[Grimdark] [Adventure]
Author: Visiden Visidane
Description: A coincidence and a magical accident leads Twilight Sparkle to a grim world hidden by Equestria's peaceful existence.
Upheaval: Breaking Point (All Links)
Upheaval: Reckoning (All Links) (New Part 64!)
Side Stories:
The Old Guard
Kin and Kind
The Last Shadows
Growing Thorns
Audio Book (Up to Chapter 48)
Additional Tags: long, war, action, drama, romance
Fan Art
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648 comments:
I was reading Upheavel again when I realized something.... I kinda want to ship Fenrir/Luna. This guy waited 1000 years just to see Luna again, was actually willing to negotiate at first(Damn Black Rose!), and was ready to start a war for her. No matter if its love or lust, this guy has something for Luna and I have an urge to right a AU with Luna agreeing to the marrige without Black Rose screwing it up...
ReplyDeleteI'm worried I've captured a shipping sickness.
@Set
ReplyDeleteyou must really hate Luna if you want that. Haven't you read about Vanguard's ancestors? I don't think Fenrir would be gentle with her... No, that filthy dog will not have My Fair Lady of the Moon.
This comment has been removed by the author.
ReplyDelete@Adalbertus Morridath
ReplyDeleteBut think about it. Fenrir, looking up into the stars, waiting for years and years, ever loyal, howling at the moon, yearning for his fair Luna to be freed from her prison...
@stringtheory
ReplyDelete*Runs to surgeon, removes inhibitor, and jumps off a bridge.*
@Set
ReplyDeleteWe don't know how fateful he was. Besides, we're talking about a guy who sent Nightmare Moon to possess her and bring her to him against her will. Seems to me that he wants a pretty slave, a doll to satisfy his needs, and one that's pretty enough to say there's no pony to match her beauty... not to mention being a princess of an enemy state does have it's benefits too.
and also *casts reanimate dead*
*cats geas curse*
congratulations, you are now a walking corpse. behave and maybe stringtheory will spend more gps on resurrection scrolls, I know only basic necromancy.
@Adalbertus Morridath
ReplyDeleteOBJECTION! There is a contradiction. Where did the author say that Fenrir sent Nightmare Moon... all they said was that Nightmare Moon possessed Luna, and that Nightmare was an ally of the wolven.
@Set
ReplyDeleteI think it was mentioned in the chapter where Nightmare Moon/Moonshadow spirit talks with Fenrir. Aster she got summoned by the alter thingy. I don't remember which chapter it was... and maybe I remember it wrong... but I don't think Nightmare Moon would work on her own in this case, she risked damaging the goods Fenrir wanted after all.
@Adalbertus Morridath
ReplyDeleteuntil we get more information on Fenrir x Luna, I'm going to side with Adalbertus on this one, Fenrir just seems too much of a monster
@Set, take off the shipping goggles (source), that should cure your shipping problem
and god help me if we start descending into ship-to-ship combat (source)
*Run's to Black Rose, convinces her to erase the necromancy spell, then turn's to dust.*
ReplyDeleteLet the war of shipping begin. I'll start.
ReplyDeleteFenrirxLuna!
@Set
ReplyDeleteShopping wars for this fanfic? There's Simple not enough potential couples here. Twilight x Vanguard is the only viable option for any romance, and I suspect their romance would be pretty awkward seeing as both have pretty low priority on social skills :p
If you want ship wars, keep Pyre x Twilight or Pyre x Vanguard options up :p
Luna's out of the game (mine! <_<)
@Adalbertus Morridath
ReplyDeleteYes... Pyre x Twilight. (Shipping Sickness completely overwhelming me.) HAHAHAAHHAH
@Set
ReplyDelete...I have to draw that some time in the future :p
@Adalbertus Morridath
ReplyDeleteI was thinking of a fic for Pyre x Twilight. Here's the description idea:
'Hate is not so different from love after all. The end result is always obsession.'
Hey where's the response?
ReplyDelete@Set
ReplyDeleteWhat kind of response to you want?
NOOOOoooooo......
would that work? :p
honestly, I don’t see how it would be even possible for the two do...well...get together at any point. They are slightly too obsessed with fighting each other and outdoing each other I magic... and every time they meet Twilight gets the last minute save from being killed, so not really a place for any romance to develop, unless against all odds Pyre will somehow survive separation form Nightmare Moon and won't be immediately executed for multiple acts of treason... which I doubt.
besides, I promised you a poster-like picture for upheaval and I'm trying to work on it, the thing takes more time to finish then I thought.
Oh by the way Adal, if you see a guy called SirusAusar on deviant art, its me Set.
ReplyDeleteNEW CHAPTER
ReplyDeleteand a note from Visdane that this one is second-to-last of this story... so I was right, multiple parts of the story. good news in my opinion... although waiting for weeks before we get a new one will be a torment.
my FF.net review:
Well... that chapter answers few questions.
Celestia is getting the outside world to get to her, finally... she's a broken pony, but she's strong enough to go through it and she's not alone and she acknowledges it.
Luna is the most responsible of the siblings.
Fluttershy is getting through that tick wall Redbrand build around his heart one hug at the time... I hope it won't go into the creepy territory though <_<
Scarlet is crazy
And the theory of Applejack being part of a love triangle is now pretty much a canon :p
Reunion between Celestia and Twilight was very well done, I only wish it could be longer. But I suppose that Celestia is exhausted and weak and Twilight does have her own duties. I would love to see Celestia walking around Bastion city in a disguise to get to know her new subjects more. Since most ponies in the North ware cloths or armor, hiding her wings should not be a problem, although she is bigger then most ponies… I suspect a glamour spell is beyond her abilities at the moment, but maybe in the future…
Applejack's promotion… I have somewhat mixed feelings about that. Not that she doesn't deserve it or anything like that, she'll be a perfect vice-captain, but... Rainbow Dash and Twilight might, for different reasons, object to that... well... RD will, Twilight might get even more desperate to prove herself and if she starts seeing AJ as a part of the romance equation… things might get even more complicated… why is it never easy with you? :p
So... a brake after the next chapter and revisions... I suppose it's a good thing, the story definitely could use some tweaks here and there to be even more awesome, not to mention recharging your creative batteries. And I may be able to finish the picture before the next chapter :p
I just hope you won't end it with a huge cliffhanger this time... wishful thinking but a man can have dreams, right? :p
right now i just can't wait for the last chapter. I have this dreadful feeling that it will be a mother of all cliffhangers
This is going to be a TRILOGY? (Begins to dance.)
ReplyDelete@Set
ReplyDeleteall we know is that there's going to be a multiple parts to this story.
yay
will it be three... maybe
ask Visdane
@Adalbertus Morridath
ReplyDeleteI could write my own review of this chapter, but I'd rather piggyback on your's, because you made most of the points I would've made, plus I'm lazy ;), and I have more important things to do (like homework, damn school...)
anyway:
apparently even Celestia's not immune to hate and rage, and she probably feels horrible at herself for that
eeyup, Luna's the most responsible of the three
I hope the fluttershy and redbrand thing turns into a father-daughter thing and not into creepy territory...
like redbrand said, scarlet is fearless and crazy, though if he's going to be more in the background, who will be the romantic interest for RD?
whoa, stormbrew's a young mare? did not see that one coming...
the love triangle with Applejack-Vanguard-Twilight, should be interesting...
eh I doubt Terrato will let Celestia out of "hiding" for as long as she remains in bastion city
I agree with you completely on Applejack's promotion, though twilight won't object to it on 'who would be the the best choice' grounds, but more on romantic grounds (he likes her, rather then me...)
knowing Visidane, it WILL BE the mother of all cliffhangers
can't wait to see your picture, it sounds awesome!
@Visidane, so this will be broken down into sub-parts? good thing I've started reading other fics, but anyway the story could use some revisions in places (can't think of any off the top of my head) most of it's minor though (missing a letter, space in the wrong place etc.)
If you are going to make the next part into a independent story, and not continue adding onto this one, you should consider moving to fimfiction.net, or writing it in google docs and then posting the links to them here on EQD, those are the two main ways I've seen most fan-fiction done here, fore the reasons stated by Set: here
A/N made me sad. Although this story does need some rewriting IMHO. Having Celestia feel bad about how she acted helps, but she was too insanely paranoid from the start. Hopefully, the continuation won't take too long, as I broke my incomplete rule on this a few weeks ago and love it.
ReplyDelete@stringtheory
ReplyDelete> though if he's going to be more in the background, who will be the romantic interest for RD?
NOOOOOOOOOOoooooooo.......
Please, don't give him ideas. No. I'd go for any other shipping for Rainbow then this. DO NOT WANT
I think Celestia will have to return to Canterlot to make sure the Hesartland is doing ok, or maybe Luna could do it. Luna is more of a pony of both worlds for me. Terrato has no experience with Heartland, Celestia has no experience with Barrier lands, Luna seems to be... neutral. She's the true princess of united Equestria.
As for Celestia walking around Bastion city... I never said Terrato has to know about it :p actually, both Luna and Celestia could do that, Luna still has her powers, it wouldn't be hard to shape shift them both into ordinary ponies and walk among mortals to get to know them. We know Luna can do this, we also know Black Rose could do this, so it's not an alicorn-only ability.
And now that we see that AJ might actually like to have some more of "the good stuff" and maybe introduce it o her friends, just think how fun it would be to have mane six having fun at Storm Brew's when two mysterious unicorn mares decide to join in :p
Actually, stringtheory, here's a material for a short spinoff :p you'd just have to time it correctly :) you're welcome :D
@ Holic
Celestia's paranoia is, In my humble opinion, the most heart-breaking and well-written personal trauma I've read in fan fiction lately. Sure, it could be done better and I hope the revised version would make it even more heart-breaking an, but I'd never say she was TOO paranoid. She feels bad now because she now realizes how insane she was before. How unjust she was and how many ponies she hurt by acting like she did over the last month or so, not to mention the last 1000 years of separation and stuff. Not being a goddess probably helped with that, because she's now vulnerable and weak, dependent on the very ponies she though had betrayed her, just to realize the truth. She was THAT paranoid and it was justified and she's recovering from it now.
And I know what you mean with that incomplete rule... it happened to me way too many times...
There is only one other fanfic that I'm following now and I'm starting to be a little worried because the author was updating it more or less as frequently as Visdane does Upheaval, but it's been two weeks since the last update...
You know, being single is not a gruesome fate.
ReplyDeleteAnd I never said it is :D
ReplyDeleteAs a matter of fact I don’t like romance plots put into a story if it's not needed and in RD's case I'm yet to see a good reason for it... well, ok, I could see few good reasons, but I'd rather refrain from exploring them. Rainbow Dash is not a pony I'd see in any romantic situation and definitely not with a crazy psycho-pegasus :|
Just saying
@Adalbertus Morridath
ReplyDeleteI don't consider myself skilled enough to write a spinoff which does this story justice, or even a random fanfic.
go talk to Set if you want that made into a spin-off, he's the one who's wearing shipping goggles ;)
I haven't suffered from a incomplete fanfic dying on me yet, so I will gladly read/follow an incomplete one.
what is the other fanfic which you're following? it sounds good
@stringtheory
ReplyDeleteI hope Visdane won't be jealous for promoting other fics here <_<
Under the Northern Lights
http://www.fanfiction.net/s/7352789/1/
descript:
Princess Luna leaves for a diplomatic mission to Tarandroland, cold northern kingdom of the reindeer, and convinces Twilight to keep her company. When there, they find themselves caught up in something quite like Luna - a remnant of the age of myths.
No, it's not a ship fic :p
Really interesting take on Luna and her divinity
Even better take on Twilight and how is she viewed in another country.
@Adalbertus Morridath
ReplyDeletethank for the link!
@stringtheory
ReplyDeletesorry, was in a rush, Thanks for the link
it is done: http://adalbertus.deviantart.com/#/d4p6mn6
ReplyDelete@Adalbertus Morridath
ReplyDeletethis needs to become the title image NOW!
awesome job on it! totally worth the wait
I posted my response to it on the DA page.
@stringtheoryThanks for comments :D
ReplyDeleteI dunno about the title page, the current one is less...crowded :P
@Adalbertus Morridath
ReplyDeletebelieve me, your picture is not crowded
not having this argument again...I say let's let Visiden decide, it is HIS story after all
@stringtheory
ReplyDelete*Rips of shipping googles.*
Dude, right now I'm thinking about an awesome AU to this fic... what if Pinky went all Pinkamena, and start switching from happy, nice Pinky, and sociopathic Pinkamena? Do you think this idea is cool?
Anyways, I won't write a completely out of place spin-off. The only exception is Pyre Valor x Twilight Sparkle, just because I love it.
Also, Ship fics can also be One-sided, so I could logically write a FenrirxLuna story.
*Grabs gun*
ReplyDeleteThis is for making me think of drunk Mane Six... going at it Adal!
*Commits Suicide... again.*
@Set
ReplyDeleteWe need a permanent resurrection enchantment here...
Anyways
Pinkie Pie is so far the big unknown. She got the least screen time and so far was pretty useless in actual fights. Now, that we have the special care squad she will have to do something combat-related. So far we have 6 combat-capable ponies and Fluttershy who could easily be a field medic. What is going to happen with Pinkie? I have no idea. I hope it will be something unpredictable :D
come to think of it, the Special Care Squad is pretty much a perfect RPG team.. slightly bigger then I'm used to, but still...
one quite powerful mage
two warriors
two scouts
lightly armored mage/rouge/blade dancer (come on, with such precise TK Rarity could probably pick locks as easily as... a certain unicorn from another fanfic)
one druid/field medic
one...emm... Pinkie Pie - a cook maybe.?
there is an artist on DA who made mane six into DnD chacacters and Pinkie was a bard, but in this universe Bards don't exist as far as I can tell. Still... Pinkie sense... heh... like I said, she's an unknown...
@Adalbertus Morridath
ReplyDeleteand one which stops Set from committing suicide
anyways
well, every team needs a cook, otherwise they'd have to eat the concentrated feed *shutters*, when out in the field
here's pinkie pie's roll: comic relief, or she could transform into Pinkamena and have crazy berserker powers and act as the team's barbarian/secret weapon, what would make it really interesting would be if she didn't remember what she did as Pinkamena, so there could be some interesting post-combat dialogue there.
or she could be some kind of psychic with her pinkie sense, like being able to sense enemy attacks or ambushes before they happen thus giving the team that advantage, so maybe a ranger?
what roles would the element of laughter have in combat?...
knowing Visiden, she'll have both a role which fits her and is highly useful to the team
@stringtheory
ReplyDeleteThanks... now I have an image of Pinkie Pie as the Hulk... “PINKIE SMASH!!!”
no thanks
the element of laughter – a perfectest morale boost? Again, in DnD she'd be a bard with all the magical songs that boost stats. For a moment I was hoping that's what her special power will be when Fenrir created that fear/blizzard thing during the last battle.
I don't think I'd like to see her as a psycho killer unless it'd be done in an interesting way. I always considered Pinkamina mode in every fanfic as a fanservice.
Besides, first we have to know what will be going on in thew next part. Since there's only one chapter left it's safe to assume that the next part of the story will start with recapturing the fort and...well... either a long march north during winter... which could be a bad idea since...well... let's say that the list of successful attempts of winter assaults on countries in cold areas of the world is pretty short (see history of Russia for references :P )
The other option is to send our favorite squad on a quest to find Black Rose. That could be interesting and I think it would be Terrato's preferred curse of action since he'd have his “favorite“ unicorn out of his mane.
There is still Nightmate Moon/Pyre to be dealt with and the Heartland to be enlightened about the war and stuff. We also have no idea what will Black Rose do in the meantime – she's too smart to just let herself he found by the Elements of Harmony and even if they will find her how will they restore Celestia’s powers?
Oh, and the other two immortal enemies, I'm pretty sure they will try to do something.
I'm pretty sure there will be plenty of time for Pinkie to develop some useful skills. Especially since I do believe each of the Elements will get a super special superpower like Applejack's truth shield... preferably without a near-death experience.
@Adalbertus Morridath
ReplyDeletenot a hulk (ugh), I was thinking more like a psycho with blades, "if you hate me, you must die!" sort of thing
*lightbulb* I've got it! the deadly trickster! that way she can find all of her "tricks/pranks" extremely funny, thus retaining her always happy (or is it bubbly?) personality, be extremely useful to the team, and have a sub-plot/chapter about her dealing with the fact that her "pranks/tricks" hurt/kill things (we've already had a similar chapters with Twilight and Applejack)
I think this last chapter will be the heartland finding out about the barrier lands and the eternal war, and the reaction to it
the next part I think will be spilt between the mane8 (we need a name for the special squad) going after Black Rose and/or nightmare moon/pyre valor, the legion taking back fangbreaker+invading wolvengard, and the heartland's reaction to the war
remember that the northern equestrian legion has had 2000+ years of experience of fighting during winter (because it lasts 6+ months), so I think they've gotten really good at it.
I think Applejack's "truth shield" was a gift from the Queen, but who knows...
last time I checked, hidden superpowers usually only activate in near-death events (this is going off of every kind of story teling ever)
Before Set kills himself again... *casts auto-ressurect coupled with reflect*. Now auto-ressurect cannot be dispelled, and he can't die.
ReplyDeleteOn the note of the 'super powers' however, I had a very interesting idea... it says in the story quite bluntly that the mane six are not in harmony anymore, but are all powerful in their own regards, so I'm thinking that maybe these 'super powers' like the truth shield, are some kind of replacement/alternate magic source (sort of like the elements of peace from Vagabond/Elements of Equestria)
@Thaecrasis
ReplyDeleteI haven't read either of those stories, so I not quite clear on what you're trying to say, I think I understand the basics of it though
p.s. don't reference other fan-fics because not all of us have read them/have the time to read them/want to read them
@Thaecrasis
ReplyDeleteHmmmm *Snaps Fingers.*
Seperates Soul from body*
@Set
ReplyDelete@Adalbertus Morridath
ReplyDeleteWhat?
@Set
ReplyDeletehmm... posting bug maybe?
this is what was suppose to go to that post:
---
@Set
Wait.. you can do that now?
Now get back to your body young man or I will bring my soul gems here <_<
@Thaecrasis
I think the not n harmony part was about them not being able to use the elements of harmony, you know, like when they got discorded... just not as drastically.
And I don't think the Queen gave AJ the shield as much as she made her aware that she can do that. I don't really have time to go through the whole conversation ith the Queen but I thing she said something along the lines of “you're the element of Honesty” to AJ, so that means the physical manifestation of the element (the necklace) is just that and the essence is in the ponies who are the bearers of the elements. And as such they have some special abilities. I'm willing to agree that Twilight's special ability is her magic, and not just because that’s her cutie mark. I suspect she will grow even stronger in the future. What of the others, I don't know.
But that's just my guess.
@Adalbertus Morridath
ReplyDeletewell I have the the time to go back and read that conversation, and you've hit the nail on the head,
I agree that the the other mane6 most likely have some kind of super power, it will probably take at least one near-death experience to bring it out,
laughter as a moral booster/anti-fear thing?
loyalty as a sword maybe? or some kind of shield but different from honesty
kindness as some kind of healing power?
generosity as...diplomacy?
and magic just as being really good/powerful with magic
@Adalbertus Morridath
ReplyDeleteI read up on soul jumping, its how some mortals stay alive it seems.
AND NO I WON'T GO Back TO MY BODY!
yay new chapter :D
ReplyDeleteboo, last chapter :(
...
I...so...emm...ok
Black Rose.... I know I dais it before but... I really, really like her as a villain, especially now.
So now we know that her plans were different and that it really was a coincident that Twilight got involved – a lucky coincident for Black Rose.
And as I suspected it will take some time for Terrato to move.
So this is it, huh? The end of part one. To be continued... and there's not even a cliffhanger involved. Visdane, you really are merciful :p
So to summaries it all for now
Black Rose survived because she scattered her clones around to preserve herself somehow and despite Terrato's efforts one of those clones survived to became the new Black Rose. She also summoned her loyal officers from the dead and she will probably recruit two more to have her own elements of...well...something. (inb4 Trixie :p)
She probably knows all weaknesses and flaws of Twilight and her friends and seeing that she's pretty good at playing ponies, she will exploit them and most probably use them to fulfill her own goals. I don't know if there is anyone of the good team to play this game of chess with her. Only Terrato knows her well enough and she already pulled played hi, not to mention Celestia. Luna...well... maybe
And then, we have the Heartland that is about to be introduced to the whole war... fortunately not all of Equestria is like Canterlot so Terrato might get few good soldiers, especially from the Western parts ... like the entire Apple family, if whatever the Queen is true, a clan with a long history of warriors. And we also know that pegasi were warrior-like at some time in history. I also wonder how will the Heartland react to the news... and to Celestia lousing her powers... and everything else for that matter.
Will there be a civil war and unrest in Equestria?
Will other enemies attack?
Will Black rose manipulate everyone or will there be a pony able to match her wits?
Will Twocolt return?
Will the Elements of Harmony be able to defeat Nightmare Moon and, a side quest for the good ending, save Pyre Valor?
How will the the six friends cope with the sudden change after the last sudden change?
Will Vanguard have a threesome?
I will be waiting patiently for updates.
Please don't let us wait too long :D
@Adalbertus Morridath
ReplyDeleteHe did something almost as bad as ending on a cliffhanger, he brought in a new plot line
Well this chapter answered a lot of questions, like how Black Rose survived and how Terrato committed the 6th rebellion
Well she still needs bodies for the now un-dead officers, it would be a shame not to have Trixie not be a part of the anti6 (we need a name for them), or Visiden could come up with OC's who are just as original and equally awesome
Well Black Rose has no equal so far, with her being a Magnificent Bastard and everything
The heartland learning about the war will be interesting, to say the least...
Maybe? we will have to see...
She's already manipulated everyone into her plan, so of course she'll keep on doing it, well if there is a equally smart/manipulative pony out there, we haven't met them yet...or one of the existing characters hasn't stepped up to the plate yet...
I doubt Twocolt will return, he was 'put on a bus' so to speak, so he might become an example of Chuck Cunningham Syndrome, or it might turn out to be a Reassignment Backfire
We'll just have to tune in next time to find out about that one...
Being put together into a special squad, for now to hunt down NMM/pyre, should be interesting for the mane6/8
Um...not answering that one...
@Visiden, please don't keep us waiting for too long, and if you let this die...
@stringtheoryWell, so far she was mostly an unknown enemy. Right now she'd be the main enemy and the good guys know about her.
ReplyDeleteAnd of course she also knows who her enemies are.
As for a competent adversary for her... I have high hopes for something like this:
http://adalbertus.deviantart.com/favourites/46406742?offset=120#/d4juitf
since Luna (on the picture by JJ above seen in human form) seems to be molded by Visdane to be perhaps the most...hmm... clever(?) of the three alicorns...
but I'm a Luna fanboy, so that could just me me :P
Black Rose told Twocolt that she won't forget what he has done for her – I have a feeling she might have some plans for him in the future.
@Adalbertus Morridath
ReplyDeleteDon't you love when plots' twist like that?
I don't understand what you're saying about she knows who her enemies are
We have agreed that Black Rose is a Magnificent Bastard, right?
Right now, Luna doesn't seem to have much power though, plus she doesn't seem to have the willingness to commit the same sort of acts Black Rose did, while another character, probably an OC wouldn't have the morals and thus could match Black Rose in terms of morally questionable deeds, but Twilight might also fit this role, if what we've seen about her motivation, but she doesn't have the sense of scale which would be necessary for this role
But among the three alicorn siblings, Luna is definitely the most clever/rational
I think that Twocolt is gone, because what good could he do for Black Rose at some obscure post? i think she just said that to keep up his spirt/keep him loyal to her
@stringtheory
ReplyDelete> I don't understand what you're saying about she knows who her enemies are
she knows that there are only 8 ponies who can cause her trouble. Terrato and Luna, who are probably the only beings powerful enough to challenge her and the Elements of Harmony who together have, in theory, enough power to defeat her.
And from those 8 ponies she knows least about Luna, who just recently was freed.
>Luna doesn't seem to have much power though
well, she's *only* Celestia's equal, so I wouldn't say she doesn't have the power
> she doesn't seem to have the willingness to commit the same sort of acts Black Rose did, while another character, probably an OC wouldn't have the morals and thus could match Black Rose in terms of morally questionable deeds
And she doesn't have to. Besides, we don't know all that much about her personality. She has a darker side to herself, don't forget about that. Besides, she doesn't have to kill ponies to gain immortality, power up mana battery or send anyone to certain death to set a stage. She'd only have to try to devise few clever moves to block Black Rose's advances. But for now we don’t even have the board set up and many figures are missing. All I';m saying is that from the available case she's the most likely, in my eyes, to have a chance against Black Rose.
...because I'm a Luna fanboy :p
> Twilight might also fit this role, if what we've seen about her motivation, but she doesn't have the sense of scale which would be necessary for this role
Twilight is a natural protagonist to Black Rose, as she is Celesta's student just like Black Rose was Terrato's, but there is a long road head of her. Black Rose has decades of experience and god-like powers. Twilight is in the legion for a little over a month. And she needs a mentor. Celestia would object to teach her anything that would corrupt her, Terrato might actually be willing to teach her but since she's too much like Black Rose in his eyes he might not want to give that knowledge and power to another pony... that leaves only Luna.
Twocolt is Applejack's weakness, one of many. Plane and simple. If Black Rose could get to him, or even convince him to follow her she'd have a valuable pawn to play against AJ in the future.
...and Visdane is probably sitting there and laughing at us and out silly ideas as he refines his plot that will render us speechless for a week :P
Chapter 48... needs some serious copy-editing. x.x
ReplyDeleteShipping: Applejack/Twocolt? Rainbow/Scarlet? Twilight/Vanguard/Pyre? I *do* like the idea of Luna/Fenris. Fenris is a big bad wolf but Luna is kind of a nightmare fetishist herself. She might enjoy it... or end up running the show.
The situation with the Black Rose is... weird. She's not *exactly* an enemy, just really freaking evil.
Twilight's ideal mentor is the Nightmare I think. Right. That's the plotline -- Twilight defeats Pyre by seducing the nightmare away from her, using it to gain power against Black Rose in return for bringing Luna around to the Wolven side.
...okay, that's really silly.
@Adalbertus Morridath
ReplyDelete> well, she's *only* Celestia's equal, so I wouldn't say she doesn't have the power
what I meant was, she's not the ruler of anywhere, she is the co-ruler of the heartland with Celestia, which I think Luna will be the main one in ruling the heartland now that Celestia no longer has her power
> Besides, we don't know all that much about her personality. She has a darker side to herself, don't forget about that.
The way the characters are now, to me the only one of the 3 alicorn siblings, who would equal Black Rose in terms of lack of morals is Terrato, but as shown even he is being to care about mortal ponies.
> She'd only have to try to devise few clever moves to block Black Rose's advances.
And right now she has command of no one in the barrier lands, they're all under command of Terrato, who I doubt would be willing to give up command some of them to Luna, despite the recent events
> ...because I'm a Luna fanboy :p
why am I listening to you on your chosen fanboy topic? it's like listening to Set on shipping...
> that leaves only Luna.
I doubt Luna will teach Twilight anything that Terrato wouldn't approve of because Terrato could kill her...
> Twocolt is Applejack's weakness, one of many. Plane and simple. If Black Rose could get to him, or even convince him to follow her she'd have a valuable pawn to play against AJ in the future.
I doubt that Twocolt will work, because Applejack knows that he's one of her weaknesses, plus Twocolt is now at some obscure post, which I doubt Black Rose could get him out of/would actually care about him anymore, but then again this IS Black Rose we're talking about here...
> ...and Visdane is probably sitting there and laughing at us and out silly ideas as he refines his plot that will render us speechless for a week.
Too bad the next chapter won't come out for several weeks...
@Visiden, where are you going to post the revised version of Upheaval?
@terrycloth
ReplyDeletegood thing Visiden will be going back and revising the whole story then, before he starts on the next part
you and Set can go off into your little corner and talk about shipping...
I do belive the term you are looking for here is 'anti-hero'
wait...WHAT? interesting idea though...
I *loved* the new set of "Your faithful student" letters, absolutely fantastic contrast to Twi's in-show letters.
ReplyDeleteAlso, I am pleased to have had my guess about the 6th rebellion proven wrong, the one Visiden revealed was much better. I still like my theory that Twi is the descendant of the rumored T/BR child, though.
Wow. Nice conclusion to breaking point! When can we expect the next section?
ReplyDelete@djthomp
ReplyDeleteWOW, I didn't even notice the "your faithful student" letters were a parody/contrast to the ones in the show until you pointed it out, that's some REALLY good writing on Visden's part
for some reason some part inside of me finds it sweet that Terrato kept the letters from Black Rose despite all she did
Well there's always AU's if you want to write a spin-off...
@Dusk Star
Visiden said "a quick break" while he goes through a round of revisions, so maybe 1-3 weeks?
@stringtheory
ReplyDelete> what I meant was, she's not the ruler of anywhere
Actually, she’s a princess of the whole Equestria now that the division is over. Technically speaking.
> And right now she has command of no one in the barrier lands, they're all under command of Terrato, who I doubt would be willing to give up command some of them to Luna, despite the recent events
Well, she could command royal guards:p
Besides, I don’t mean she'll do it now. There is time, she will have to prove herself to her brother as both a competent ruler and a skilled tactitian to get any influence on his army.
> why am I listening to you on your chosen fanboy topic? it's like listening to Set on shipping...
Because outside of that I make valid points sometimes :P
> I doubt Luna will teach Twilight anything that Terrato wouldn't approve of because Terrato could kill her...
Both Luna and Twilight have a pretty poor record of doing what Terrato or Celestia told them to do… or not doing things they are forbidden to do.
> I doubt that Twocolt will work […]
We’ll see…
As for the next part of Upheaval... it’s 48 chapters long, revision could take a little bit more than 3 weeks. :( I don’t know if Visdane is going to do it all by himself or does he plan on getting a beta reader...
Also, now that the story is complete we might expect few more readers popping up since…well… the in progress rule no longer applies :)
@Adalbertus Morridath
ReplyDelete> Actually, she’s a princess of the whole Equestria now that the division is over. Technically speaking.
Luna's always been overshadowed by Celestia in the heartland and not exactly welcome in the Barrier lands by Terrato, but now with Celestia's loss of power, Luna will probably have to have more of a governing role in the Heartland
> she will have to prove herself to her brother as both a competent ruler and a skilled tactician to get any influence on his army.
but how can she prove that she's a skilled tactician if he won't give her command over any troops?
> Because outside of that I make valid points sometimes :P
that is true...
> Both Luna and Twilight have a pretty poor record of doing what Terrato or Celestia told them to do… or not doing things they are forbidden to do.
true, but I think Terrato will keep a close eye on both Luna and Twilight...
> Also, now that the story is complete we might expect few more readers popping up since…well… the in progress rule no longer applies :)
someone needs to tell the EQD staff then because the title says "Update Part 48!" not "Update Complete"
plus the story is far from over, it's just this section/part which is finished
@stringtheory
ReplyDelete> Luna's always been overshadowed by Celestia in the heartland and not exactly welcome in the Barrier lands by Terrato, but now with Celestia's loss of power, Luna will probably have to have more of a governing role in the Heartland
you're missing the point here. Soon there will be no Barrier Lands and Heartland, the barrier is gone, the division will soon be meaningless, all three siblings will became equal co-rulers of all of Equestria. sure, Terrato will keep control over the Legion, but the civil matters will probably be transferred to the princesses.
> but how can she prove that she's a skilled tactician if he won't give her command over any troops?
I don't know, I'm not the author here. But if she will, then it will be something awesome :p
> true, but I think Terrato will keep a close eye on both Luna and Twilight...
As if that never backfired before. Besides, he knows that the elements of Harmony are probably the only means through which they could defeat both Nightmare Moon and Black Rose. obviously he will want them to be as well trained as possible. like I said, i doubt he will involve himself but he just might look the other way when Luna does it.
> someone needs to tell the EQD staff then because the title says "Update Part 48!" not "Update Complete"
I think that's up to Visdane to do.
I was thinking about the heartland and all the enchantments that were put in place by 'tia to tame the wild life. Do you think those enchantments are still in place now that the barrier is gone?
Also, who do you think we'll see joining the Legion? I mean aside from half of the Apple family that is :p
@Adalbertus Morridath
ReplyDelete> but the civil matters will probably be transferred to the princesses.
it will probably take a while for the two separate bureaucracies to integrate, but yes the princess will most likely run the civil matters in both the heartland and the barrier lands now
> I don't know, I'm not the author here. But if she will, then it will be something awesome :p
I've never really though of Luna as the type to lead an army, she seems more like the type who would run the espionage division
> Besides, he knows that the elements of Harmony are probably the only means through which they could defeat both Nightmare Moon and Black Rose. obviously he will want them to be as well trained as possible.
so far in the story the main6/8 are only going after NMM not BR yet, because Terrato know's that BR is too smart/powerful for the main6/8 to take on
> Do you think those enchantments are still in place now that the barrier is gone?
IDK, but if they're gone, the heartland will have dragon and hydra problems very soon...
> Also, who do you think we'll see joining the Legion?
the griffons, because they were inside of the barrier as well
Trixie, either as a legionnaire (that would be awesome), or as a minion of BR, maybe she'll become a legionnaire first then be swayed by BR?
probably most of the secondary/background characters will join up, but not Derpy, she has medical issues, though she might be able to serve in another way...
I wonder how the CMCs will react to finding out that the ponies from the barrier lands have no cutie marks?
@stringtheory
ReplyDelete> it will probably take a while for the two separate bureaucracies to integrate, but yes the princess will most likely run the civil matters in both the heartland and the barrier lands now
True, but seeing as Terrato wants to get Heartland ponies drafted as soon as possible and be able to get resources from there, I think that some elements of the integration would have to be rushed in or it will soon turn into hordes of legionnaires pillaging Equestria.
> I've never really though of Luna as the type to lead an army, she seems more like the type who would run the espionage division
and I never wanted Luna to command armies. But she could take over special operations of maybe even create her own, more secret squads to track Black Rose and her followers in secret.
> so far in the story the main6/8 are only going after NMM not BR yet, because Terrato know's that BR is too smart/powerful for the main6/8 to take on
and the most important word in this sentence is 'yet' :p who knows, maybe it will take two more “Breaking points” to get there, but they will get there eventually :p
> the griffons, because they were inside of the barrier as well
gryphons were mythical antagonists of horses, as a matter of fact, gryphons hunted and ate horses. So the next reunion with Gilda can turn to be messy <_<
> Trixie, either as a legionnaire (that would be awesome), or as a minion of BR, maybe she'll become a legionnaire first then be swayed by BR?
That would be a little bit too predictable I think, but who knows, if done in an interesting way...
> probably most of the secondary/background characters will join up, but not Derpy, she has medical issues, though she might be able to serve in another way...
Derpy will be the greatest hero the Legion ever had :p
> I wonder how the CMCs will react to finding out that the ponies from the barrier lands have no cutie marks?
… Cutie Mark Crusaders Legionnaires? Fortunately they are too young for that.
All Derpy needs is an eyepatch, and she'll become the greatest general of the legion. n.n
ReplyDeleteAnd the CMC will just lie about their age. Or claim that they're not really Chosen -- look! No cutie marks!
@Adalbertus Morridath
ReplyDelete> I think that some elements of the integration would have to be rushed in or it will soon turn into hordes of legionnaires pillaging Equestria.
we will have to see...
> But she could take over special operations of maybe even create her own, more secret squads to track Black Rose and her followers in secret.
yes but BR would have seen this coming and thus give the special squads false information.
> and the most important word in this sentence is 'yet' :p who knows, maybe it will take two more “Breaking points” to get there, but they will get there eventually :p
true, so very true...
> gryphons were mythical antagonists of horses, as a matter of fact, gryphons hunted and ate horses. So the next reunion with Gilda can turn to be messy <_<
maybe the griffons will become enemies, because they'll be mad that they had no say in being behind the barrier?
> That would be a little bit too predictable I think, but who knows, if done in an interesting way...
well what other plot line can you come up for Trixie?
>Cutie Mark Crusaders Legionnaires? Fortunately they are too young for that.
what I meant was finding out that cutie marks are just a labeling system which Celestia came up with
@terrycloth, I doubt she'll be smart/skilled enough to become a general, maybe they can use her as a WMD (weapon of mass derp)?
the CMC are obviously too young to join the legion
@stringtheory
ReplyDeleteWeapon of mass derp? You sir are an evil genius :p
but then again
When I was digging out my car from a huge pile of snow this lovely morning I got this wonderful idea: what if Derpy is in fact Celestia's secret agent sent to Ponyville to keep an eye on Twilight and her friends?
Ah, but she was obviously there before Twilight came to Ponyville – you might say
it is true of curse, but we know that Celestia planned and staged this whole thing for Twilight to find the right ponies with the right character traits to become her friends and bearers of the elements – or maybe they were bearers before that and Derpy would be sent there to keep an eye on them?
Where did I get that idea? Well, she happens to be in various strange places during some of the adventures our heroines had.
And you didn't get the eye patch reference :p
now back to quote wars...
> yes but BR would have seen this coming and thus give the special squads false information.
And that is why the pony responsible for the special squad must be at least as skilled and Black Rose. Again, I say it should be Luna because I really really like Luna and I want her to play major part in this plot. It can be someone else, it could be Celestia, or Twilight, or Terrato or even an unknown OC pony. The point is, there is potential in this situation and I'm sure there are smart tv tropes you can find for that :p
> maybe the griffons will become enemies, because they'll be mad that they had no say in being behind the barrier?
That, or they might be an uneasy ally against the common enemies.
> well what other plot line can you come up for Trixie?
Well, for one, she could be completely left out of the story.
Or she might be an ordinary soldier and she ends up being weak, poorly trained cannon fodder with no combat experience who is stuck in some completely meaningless fort that never gets to see any actual fight. Or she might die in a battle (for reasons raging from heroic to meaningless). And that is of course if she even gets to join the Legion, don't forget she's a coward.
I never really understood the hype she gets from the fandom. She never showed any, and I repeat, any interest in Twilight. For all we know she doesn't even know her name at that point. Besides, if I can be completely honest here, she may have lied about her abilities, but she is a stage perform,er and Great and Powerful Trixie is her stage name. That is what she calls herself while on stage, not who she really is. She's an actress who knows few tricks and knows how to sell them. If anything, after watching the episode with her I felt really sorry for her. And not for a moment I thought that she might hate Twilight for being better at magic... or have a secret crush on her after all that <_<
I honestly hope that if Visdane decided to include her in the story, she's more realistic character.
> what I meant was finding out that cutie marks are just a labeling system which Celestia came up with
do you think ponies will still be getting cutie marks now?
@Adalbertus Morridath
ReplyDelete> Weapon of mass derp? You sir are an evil genius :p
well we saw what she did to the town hall, just give her armor and protective spells, and point her at the enemy ;P
> what if Derpy is in fact Celestia's secret agent sent to Ponyville to keep an eye on Twilight and her friends?
that would explain her lack of a job in canon..., unless you count her being a part of that moving company a long time ago (how she got to be the mail-mare in fanon I will never know)
no I did not get the eyepatch reference, care to explain?
> And that is why the pony responsible for the special squad must be at least as skilled [as] Black Rose. The point is, there is potential in this situation [...]
true, but knowing Visiden, his version is probably 10x more awesome then anything we could come up with
> That, or they might be an uneasy ally against the common enemies.
we'll just have to find out...
> Well, for one, she could be completely left out of the story [...]
well that might happen...
but I doubt that she won't join the legion because it is a draft and getting a pass would probably mean admitting that you're weak (that would go against her arrogance, but maybe that was all part of her stage act as well?)
> I never really understood the hype she gets from the fandom.
I agree that the amount of Trixie hype is too damn high
> do you think ponies will still be getting cutie marks now?
IDK, if it was directly tied to the barrier then no, if was some kind of spell which Celestia had to maintain then no, if it was some kind of separate enchantment then maybe?
@stringtheory
ReplyDelete> no I did not get the eyepatch reference, care to explain?
http://equestria-prevails.deviantart.com/art/On-The-Eve-of-Battle-270466249?q=gallery%3Aequestria-prevails%2F33286805&qo=6
http://equestria-prevails.deviantart.com/art/General-Derpy-261702196?q=gallery%3Aequestria-prevails%2F33286805&qo=11
http://equestria-prevails.deviantart.com/art/Aerial-Skirmish-263784855?q=gallery%3Aequestria-prevails%2F33286805&qo=7
enjoy :D
> true, but knowing Visiden, his version is probably 10x more awesome then anything we could come up with
that is what I hope for :P
> but I doubt that she won't join the legion because it is a draft and getting a pass would probably mean admitting that you're weak (that would go against her arrogance, but maybe that was all part of her stage act as well?)
we'll just have to wait patiently and see what the next part will bring.
@Adalbertus Morridath
ReplyDeleteso obviously, anyone+eyepatch = looks like a badass
right now the heartland is leading in the number of WMDs (derpy and screwball)
> we'll just have to wait patiently and see what the next part will bring.
*tries waiting patiently, after 5 mins gives up* the next chapter would've have been out by now, I can't take this waiting...
and besides we're running out of stuff to debate about, normally the next chapter would've brought along enough material to debate about until the next chapter after that, but with no new chapters, we either have to come up with our own topics, or keep debating the old ones...THIS. IS. THE. WORST. POSSIBLE. THING!
*Starts shivering in a corner.*
ReplyDeleteMUST HAVE UPDATE! I CAN'T TAKE IT ANYMORE!
*Kills Himself.*
@Set
ReplyDelete*Set gets resurrected by the auto-resurrect spell*
don't kill yourself, I know what you're going through, because I'm suffering from the same thing, together we can get through this, I hope...
I would recommend other fan-fics as a distraction, and if you NEED Upheaval, listen to the audio recording of it (the reader is up to chapter 11 now) it's pretty good
Hey, just so I can say I'm still here.
ReplyDeleteI'm STILL HERE!
@Set
ReplyDeleteI'm STILL HERE TOO!
anyway since because we're obviously bored out of our minds because we'v got nothing to discuss, I'm going to start a topic: does pegasi weather control/magic still work in the heartland now that the barrier is down? non-acceptable answers: anything along the lines of "we'll just have to wait to find out" because that just kills the discussion
@Set
ReplyDeleteSo am I, but there is not too much going on. To be honest I wish Visdane could post here from time to time informing us on the progress or something...
And he could probably inform the admins/mods here that this part of the story is done and that they can somehow update the title/content.
@stringtheory
ReplyDeleteYes, it works. Barrier lands pegasi can do it too, they just don't because they have other things to worry about then ensuring a nice weather for someone's birthday.
@Adalbertus Morridath
ReplyDeleteum, in chap 13, vanguard and rainbow have a this conversation:
"We don't have weather pegasi." Vanguard said. "You mean to tell me that the weather in the Heartland is…managed by ponies?"
It was Rainbow's turn to come to realization. "Oh no…don't tell me this is like the Everfree Forest! Clouds moving by themselves…that is so creepy."
"The weather takes care of itself." Vanguard said. "No job opening for weather pegasi here, I'm afraid. I'm sure Reconnaissance could use you though."
because if they could they would use the weather as a weapon against their enemies, want to slow down an advancing army? just make it pour on them so the trail/road becomes mud, thus slowing them down, and just think how overpowered tornadoes and lightning would be...
it makes sense why Visiden took that ability out
@stringtheory
ReplyDeleteWell, it could be the case, but I think it's more like they never even tried to control the weather, they don't have the huge infrastructure to do it (Claudsdale's weather factory for example). Pegasi in the Barrier lands still have the basic abilities to interact with clouds and stuff, they just never got the brilliant idea to use them to manage weather. In Heartland it's an entire industry, in Barrier Lands pegasi are needed for other things.
As for using it as a weapon... I don't think it would be as efficient as you think. If you need for example 10 pegasi to create a storm big enough to slow down an army and they have to work whole day to do so, then it's much better for them to organize some kid of a trap of simply a fly by with crossbows or bombs and destroy a bridge or blow up supply wagons.
But if you want another good topic for discussion, there here it is: Hearthland's technology - we know ponies have electricity (and dames) technology to create tall buildings and flying ships, not to mention magically powered mobile cider factories. Of course maybe Barrier lands also have their technology developed but we haven't seen it so far. Suspect unicorn engineers from Heartland could be really useful in developing new weapons such as tanks, flying battleships, armored pegasi carriers or even new kinds of range weapons, more deadly then crossbows.
@Adalbertus Morridath
ReplyDeleteyeah that makes sense, but I still think they would've found someway to use it against their enemies
yeah, the medieval stasis of the barrier lands is kinda weird, it's been 2000+ years and they still haven't moved beyond swords and crossbows, I guess constant war kinda puts a damper on innovation
and who knows, maybe the heartland in Upheaval, doesn't have electricity and dams?
I guess bastion city being at the very north wouldn't have access to the latest tech, but wouldn't it have been mentioned then?
Just finished a single run-through of the story just trimming dialogue tags, fixing awkward sentences and supplying missing words. Even that took a surprising amount of time and cut out around 6k+ words.
ReplyDeleteI highly suspect my ability to self edit. If any of you find some errors feel free to point it out at once so I can fix it right away.
@Visiden Visidane
ReplyDeletegreat! now I have an excuse to re-read the whole story
where should we post our edits?
will these edits just be integrated into the copy on fanfiction.net, or will you post the edited version somewhere else?
Oooooo, the first chapter of the new story is up on FF.net. Excellent start Visiden.
ReplyDelete@stringtheory
ReplyDeleteYou can just post here in the comments section like previous commenters have done. Mention what the error is and where it can be found and I'll handle the rest.
@Visiden Visidane
ReplyDeletefound this in the new story:
"So, uh…that's some interesting music that Pinkie found." Twilight said. "Is it the sort of music that's popular in the HEARTLAND?"
don't you mean Barrier Lands? because then Twilight's comment would make sense
Well, this is an surprising b-day gift (a day early, but still) :D
ReplyDeleteand it came much sooner then expected :)
The first chapter of new story in a well established world of yours and you're starting with sending Spike away... for a training... with a half-dragon half-pony... so... it's possible for ponies(unicorns even) and dragons to mate and have kinds... that's a happy news for Spike and Rarity... well... mostly for Spike :p
Terrato sending Luna to Canterlot to prepare the general public and answer all the questions of angry and terrified ponies... pretty much what I expected. Dealing with dragons, that was new. It also answers out questions about the enchantments within the barrier. It still leaves griffons and other creatures, especially in Everfree.
And at the very end we have a little taste of something what might be the main driving force of division between the element of Harmony now – jealousy between AJ and Twilight. Or to be more precise, a jealous Twilight. I wonder if AJ already told them about the promotion.
On a bright side, it's good to see that AJ and RD are talking now.
An here I was thinking that I have to brace myself for weeks more to see another chapter. Keep it up :)
so, will there be a new EDQ page for that new story or is this now the all things Upheaval page?
@Adalbertus Morridath
ReplyDeletehappy (early) birthday to you then!
well a kirin, is unicorn+lust dragon, and knowing equestria these hybrids are probably as welcome as wolven+pony hybrids
we need more explanation on the different types of dragons, so apparently they correspond to the 7 deadly sins, and pride dragons are the closest to being 'civilized', I wonder which one spike will turn out to be?
so spike received a dare from Terrato to take a level in badass, hopefully the story will follow him through the western barrier lands (yay, new area!), and not just have spike be put on a bus, to come back six months later, having taken a level in badass, and probably more fully grown as well
and now with spike gone, Twilight will need someone to lean on, this will probably be Vanguard and when she gets told that he choose applejack to be vice-captain, the jealousy will most likely be increased by 10x, this should be interesting...
the new story got posted to this page because it's a sequel, so yes this page is the all things upheaval page
@stringtheory
ReplyDeletedamn html tags, one of my hyper links didn't work,
reposting that line:
so spike received a dare from Terrato to take a level in badass
Argh.... I HAVE RETURNED FROM MADNESS! Now i must comment on Upheavel.... Uh..... new chapter rocks....
ReplyDeleteWow, I was expecting longer between stories. Awesome start.
ReplyDeleteWaiting for an update nooooow.
ReplyDelete(Grabs sword.)
I'm bored.
(Stabs self.)
I've been thinking about the super special superpowers for the Elements of harmony... I mean, I think we've seen them actually. We have Fluttershy's stare what is obviously something more than just an very out of place authority look on her face. We also have Pinkie sense and her ability to ignore laws of physics... but that's just the show I think. And then there is Sonic Rainbow and Twilight's super spell capacity, but I'm not sure if those are equal to the truth shield. So theoretically the only thing left is a special power foe Rarity and that is only if we don't count her precise TK. Although with the exception of AJ and Twilight their "powers" don't really have much to do with their elements so it might not be it.
ReplyDeleteAnd yes, I know I'm going through the idea of super powers again, but I really like it... and I don't want AJ to be too special, she's already little miss perfect in the sow... not that I don't love her anyway :p
@Adalbertus Morridath
ReplyDeletehere's some copy-paste from an earlier post I made:
I agree that the the other mane6 most likely have some kind of super power, it will probably take at least one near-death experience to bring it out,
laughter as a moral booster/anti-fear thing?
loyalty as a sword maybe? or some kind of shield but different from honesty
kindness as some kind of healing power?
generosity as...diplomacy?
copy-paste ends here
but I do have to say that it makes sense that applejack got her's first, because the other mane6 already have those 'not normal' abilities going for them already, while applejack had nothing
@stringtheoryYeah, I remember your post. I was just thinking that these abilities they already have might be the only abilities that they get and like you said, AJ was just strong and hard working pony. But I don't see how their abilities could be connected to the elements of harmony they represent.
ReplyDelete@Adalbertus Morridath
ReplyDeleteI just think it would be very underwhelming if the other mane6 already had their special abilities already, plus the abilities they already have don't exactly line up with their elements either, having honesty be a shield makes sense, the other ones I'm not sure about, but see my previous post if I had to guess
@stringtheory
ReplyDeleteThe most confusing are Rarity, Fluttershy and Pinkie. Pinkie is the element of Laughter yet she has her Pinkie sense which doesn't really have anything to do with laughter, especially when she's getting less joyful predictions. And her special cutie mark based talent is a party, which we saw she can organize even in Bastion City in an hour or so. if there really are Element-based powers similar to the truth shield (by the way, was it even addressed anywhere after the battle? I don't remember reading about it and I suspect at least Twilight would be interested in actually researching it) it would be something along the lines of moral/luck/fortitude - how will it manifest, I have no idea. However I suspect Pinkie's mental breakdown before so that she can discover it in her most darker moment.
Rarity... her element is generosity, she has precise telekinesis and her cutie mark talent is... well... making pretty things. However from the last battle we know she is a rather capable fighter and she does not hesitate to act (first episode, the manticore and the serpent moments) she also has a pretty practical view on using wolven leather. And again, I know we didn't get too much time to deal with it, but Rarity's actions during the battle and after the battle are yet to be discussed between the main cast and I hope we will get some more development and maybe (just maybe) a bounding moment between her and Twilight - the pony she probably feels she betray and failed. As for potential special ability, or how generosity fits it all - I have no idea.
Fluttershy, the medic, the element of kindness and a pony who stared down a dragon. In my humble opinion, the most badass scene in the entire series belongs to her – Fluttershy protecting three little fillies with her own body while staring down a cockatrice who is slowly turning her into stone. So far there is nothing in the series to beat that. So we know Fluttershy can be insanely brave when she is saving/protecting someone and the stare can merely be a manifestation of her determination and will in those situations. I'm hoping for a lot of development around that (as well as waiting for the next episode). As far as special power goes, probably healing ability or something similar and maybe some more control over the stare and more confidence. As for an eye-opening event - probably some kind of an insanely brave action to save someone or something like that.
just read all the chapters and all the comments on both EqD and FF in one go. my eyes are bleeding. O_O (not really :p)
ReplyDeleteawesome story, i'll be paying really close attention to this in the future! and something that everyone seems to be forgetting, we've gotten all the way to rebellion #7 of 9. wanna bet #9 is the climactic battle in part 3 with Father coming down to ruin everyone's day?
oh, also! Lexarius is still lazing about over in Vestibulum waiting for a certain currently-depowered somepony to do something to his garden decoration of a body sitting RIGHT IN THE MIDDLE OF CHAOTIC HEARTLAND. maybe, just maybe he's going to factor into the wars? And Oceanus is also a loose end just SCREAMING chekhov's gunman. lots of potential new players in a huge, probably disastrous Gambit Pileup. if Black Rose herself has been played all along by a Man Behind the Man, i'll be laughing so hard. and buying the author a drink. nah, i'll just be throwing money at the screen.
if you can't tell i'm EXTREMELY interested in the extremely large scale, and i've got a feeling pretty big prophecies are going to be coming true left and right as this story goes on. Looking forward to more chapters!
@Adalbertus Morridath
ReplyDeleteum...wall-of-text much?
>if there really are Element-based powers similar to the truth shield (by the way, was it even addressed anywhere after the battle? I don't remember reading about it and I suspect at least Twilight would be interested in actually researching it)
I think right now everyone's in a 'glad to be alive' mode, plus it'll probably be brought up pretty soon...
>However I suspect Pinkie's mental breakdown before so that she can discover it in her most darker moment.
yeah, that will probably happen, with her becoming pinkamena for x amount of time
> And again, I know we didn't get too much time to deal with it, but Rarity's actions during the battle and after the battle are yet to be discussed between the main cast and I hope we will get some more development and maybe (just maybe) a bonding moment between her and Twilight
I think the post battle discussion will be coming up in the next chapter, even though it's been 3+ days since the attack
> As for potential special ability, or how generosity fits it all - I have no idea.
maybe, being able to enchant weapons/armor to make them more powerful? but she has to put a ton of time into them? this would make sense considering how long she spent on each dress back in the heartland
another plot twist is that Hammer Chain get killed/put on a bus/gets promoted, and rarity gets the forge all to herself, where she starts improving the weapons/armor, and maybe even inventing some new stuff (magical firearm maybe?), thus moving the barrier lands out of the medieval stasis it's been in for the past 1000+ years (maybe the tech's been improving at a very slow rate?), though we don't have a comparison to what the tech was like 1000+ years ago, so maybe they've been progressing at a normal rate? or maybe they don't need to improve their tech because they have magic?
> the stare can merely be a manifestation of her determination and will in those situations. I'm hoping for a lot of development around that
well as we've seen with her using the stare on SR, it basically reduces her awareness of everything else going on around her to almost none, so using it in the middle of battle...not such a smart idea, and plus if the target is crazy enough (again see SR) the stare might backfire...
> As for an eye-opening event - probably some kind of an insanely brave action to save someone or something like that.
it'll probably have something to do with saving Redbrand's soul...
@The Wandering Magus
ReplyDelete> just read all the chapters and all the comments on both EqD and FF in one go. my eyes are bleeding. O_O (not really :p)
I know the feeling...
> we've gotten all the way to rebellion #7 of 9. wanna bet #9 is the climactic battle in part 3 with Father coming down to ruin everyone's day?
well considering it's been 700+ (or was it 800+?) years since the last rebellion, I doubt we'll see another rebellion, unless the story either goes multi-generational (that would be AWESOME!) or there's time travel (most likely leading into a we-have-to-change-the-past-to-stop-the-end-of-the-world-from-happening plot line, which has been done a lot), but yes it would make sense that the final battle/ending would be against the King
> Lexarius is still lazing about over in Vestibulum waiting for a certain currently-depowered somepony to do something to his garden decoration of a body sitting RIGHT IN THE MIDDLE OF CHAOTIC HEARTLAND. maybe, just maybe he's going to factor into the wars?
eh, I doubt he'll be brought back, because that would just be opening the sealed evil in a can and if all the chaos does bring discord back that'll be yet another Spanner in the works for the alicorns on top of the 15 OTHER spanners that got thrown in over the course of the story
> Oceanus is also a loose end just SCREAMING chekhov's gunman
um, I believe you're misinterpreting the trope Chekhov's Gunman: "Any character who is innocuously and unimportantly introduced to the viewer, but who later proves to be important by the end of the episode." Last time I checked Oceanus was the original Big Bad, but yes he could be the mastermind behind it all, which would be an awesome twist, and the whole mortal ponies being created is just a plan-within-a-plan for overthrowing the King...
> lots of potential new players in a huge, probably disastrous Gambit Pileup
well a Gambit Pileup will most likely come out in Black Rose's favor (with her being a Magnificent Bastard and everything)
FINALLY, I have someone to trade tropes with, if your going to be sticking around that is, (if you are, you should start hyperlinking stuff (like tropes), if you don't know how, go here
@stringtheory
ReplyDelete> um...wall-of-text much?
enter wall of text has been doubled joke here :p
> I think right now everyone's in a 'glad to be alive' mode, plus it'll probably be brought up pretty soon...
> I think the post battle discussion will be coming up in the next chapter, even though it's been 3+ days since the attack
true, the last few days were probably pretty busy for them, with Celestia lousing her powers and all the other revelations I guess we'll see what the future brings.
> maybe, being able to enchant weapons/armor to make them more powerful? but she has to put a ton of time into them? this would make sense considering how long she spent on each dress back in the heartland
I haven't thought of that... you may be up to something :D
> another plot twist is that Hammer Chain get killed/put on a bus/gets promoted, and rarity gets the forge all to herself, where she starts improving the weapons/armor, and maybe even inventing some new stuff (magical firearm maybe?), thus moving the barrier lands out of the medieval stasis it's been in for the past 1000+ years (maybe the tech's been improving at a very slow rate?), though we don't have a comparison to what the tech was like 1000+ years ago, so maybe they've been progressing at a normal rate? or maybe they don't need to improve their tech because they have magic?
I don't think he has to go for Rarity to be promoted. And I don't know if she will be returning to her duties since she's now a member of a spec ops squad. I think what we will see in the future is some kind of team training sessions or something to improve their fighting and tactics.
as for technological improvements, I suspect technologically superior Heartland would be a much bigger boost for the Barrier Lands then whatever Rarity could think of.
> well as we've seen with her using the stare on SR, it basically reduces her awareness of everything else going on around her to almost none, so using it in the middle of battle...not such a smart idea, and plus if the target is crazy enough (again see SR) the stare might backfire...
True, that's why I said that some improvements could be made in the way she uses it.
> it'll probably have something to do with saving Redbrand's soul...
maybe... but I think that has more to do with bringing her down to the ground but at the same time keeping the core her old self intact.
and by the way, as an old time trekkie, am I the only one who thinks McCoy every time when I think about the old doctor? :p
@The Wandering Magus
ReplyDelete>> just read all the chapters and all the comments on both EqD and FF in one go. my eyes are bleeding. O_O (not really :p)
>I know the feeling...
so do I...
>> we've gotten all the way to rebellion #7 of 9. wanna bet #9 is the climactic battle in part 3 with Father coming down to ruin everyone's day?
> well considering it's been 700+ (or was it 800+?) years since the last rebellion, I doubt we'll see another rebellion, unless the story either goes multi-generational (that would be AWESOME!) or there's time travel (most likely leading into a we-have-to-change-the-past-to-stop-the-end-of-the-world-from-happening plot line, which has been done a lot), but yes it would make sense that the final battle/ending would be against the King
I actually think it could be possible to go all the way to the 9th rebellion. We still have the prophecy thingy the wolven priestess was talking about, I'm not sure it came true just yet. As for Oceanus... I don't think he's going to get involved. Upheaval is about a struggle between mortal ponies, a struggle to stay true to themselves in a hostile world. who knows, maybe if done right... right now I want to read how little marshmallow ponies are dealing with horrors of war :D
and please, no time traveling... it's the fastest way to fail...
> FINALLY, I have someone to trade tropes with, if your going to be sticking around that is, (if you are, you should start hyperlinking stuff (like tropes), if you don't know how, go here
Great, not I'll have to read references to understand two posters, not just one :p
Also, welcome The Wandering Magus, I hope you will be sticking around for a while. this place was rather slow lately.
My policy is to normally not add to discussions especially by throwing in spoilers or things only the author can know. I think these bits can be shared though.
ReplyDelete1. Remember that the 9th rebellion is guaranteed to be Oceanus'. Only the 8th rebellion is an unknown.
2. The gap between the 6th and 7th rebellion is indeed quite long. Remember that the gap between the 4th and 5th rebellion is quite short.
3. The Barrier Lands is not on a strict "medieval stasis" (see turntable) the only guideline the show has about technology levels is that technology in Equestria is as advanced or underdeveloped as the creators want it to be. I follow that same guideline.
@Visiden Visidane
ReplyDeleteI really appreciate that you keep the spoilers away from us :p to be honest sometimes I'm afraid that just by sitting here, discussing and guessing things we might spoil the story for ourselves.
I forgot about the fact that the 9th was Oceanus' rebellion. I don't know why I thought it was 9 and then Oceanus steps on the stage. But yeah, that leaves just one, so we're pretty much a step away from … the big something.
As for the technology level, you haven't really hinted if there are any technological differences between both parts of Equestria, but I'd imagine there has to be a lot. Over a 1000 years of separation... in our universe we wouldn't even be able to communicate because the languages would drift so far apart... but I suppose having an immortal ruler allows to keep at least this in check. Basically, I wonder just how will it looks like.
@Visiden Visidane
ReplyDelete> Remember that the 9th rebellion is guaranteed to be Oceanus'. Only the 8th rebellion is an unknown.
wait...Oceanus will come back to commit the 9th rebellion? that's a pretty big spoiler you've dropped there...
> The Barrier Lands is not on a strict "medieval stasis" (see turntable) the only guideline the show has about technology levels is that technology in Equestria is as advanced or underdeveloped as the creators want it to be. I follow that same guideline.
okay...makes sense, I guess...but please don't flip flop on the tech level of either the barrier lands or the heartland, that just leads to unnecessary confusion
@Adalbertus Morridath
ReplyDelete> I haven't thought of that... you may be up to something :D
that's why I'm here to think outside of the box, that means I can also think inside of the warzone
> I suspect technologically superior Heartland would be a much bigger boost for the Barrier Lands then whatever Rarity could think of.
well now that the Word of God has come down stating that the tech level is all plot dependent, then the answer is we'll just have to wait and see (cop-out answer, yes)
> am I the only one who thinks McCoy every time when I think about the old doctor? :p
no, but now I will...
Ha! I knew Celestia will go out in a disguise :D I thought it would be with Luna and agains Terrato's wishes but still :D
ReplyDeleteAnd that order certainly explains the distinct lack of changes in Equestrian language at least on one side of the barrier. I suspect Celesia had something similar on her side, or she did it herself somehow.
New weapon for Applejack... a little unexpected, but she knows ho to deal with things like that so I suspect her combat skills will improve.
The bad news is that since the Elements of Harmony still lack harmony, their involvement in siege of Fangbreaker will be problematic at best. Especially now with Twilight being jealous and probably not even knowing about it. In ant case I can't wait for the next chapter :D
Okay, since I'm bored. Lets decide upon something.
ReplyDeleteWho's the best god? (Black Rose doesn't count.)
@Set
ReplyDeleteyou have to be more specific, does discord count as a god? does the Queen count? does Celestia not count since she lost her powers? you have to make these things clear...
but since Black Rose doesn't count, I'll have to go with Luna because she's the most reasonable of the 3 alicorn siblings
Any god except for Black Rose.
ReplyDelete@Adalbertus Morridath
ReplyDelete> New weapon for Applejack... a little unexpected, but she knows ho to deal with things like that so I suspect her combat skills will improve.
unless I'm missing something, Applejack was just using tramplers in that sparing session with Vanguard, no mention of her using a different weapon, unless you're talking about the truth shield
btw, are you working on a new piece of fan art?
because if you need ideas, you should totally do one of scarlet rabbit
@Set
ReplyDelete> unless I'm missing something, Applejack was just using tramplers in that sparing session with Vanguard, no mention of her using a different weapon, unless you're talking about the truth shield
Light strong enchanted chain - could be used as a whip or a lasso - see Wonder Woman’s magic rope thingy that compels people to tell the truth. I'm not sure it this was intentional or not, but for me the reference is kinda obvious. AJ mastered lasso tricks, so dealing with that chain should probably be pretty easy once she gets used to it.
> btw, are you working on a new piece of fan art?
>because if you need ideas, you should totally do one of scarlet rabbit
but I don't like him. I had one scene in mind, but it will take some time before I start. It needs to be dynamic enough and I still need to work on that.
> Who's the best god? (Black Rose doesn't count.)
Our Lady of the Moon of course. Was there ever any doubt?
@stringtheory
ReplyDeleteimma try to link. let's see if this works before i actually try commenting for realz
I think Oceanus is going to be the Man Behind the Man and show up in part 3.
^should link to tvtropes...
@stringtheory
ReplyDeleteRemember back when AJ was in the Vestibulum? The Queen said "Firstborn Oceanus began the cycle and it will be he who will end it".
Having tech levels that vary widely isn't necessarily confusing or bad. Even as it is they've got all sorts of tech from completely different eras and it hasn't been too bad so far. Although, the Heartland in MLP canon has heart monitors and the Barrier Lands seem to be lacking in it so far...
It's just like AJ to have trouble making her opponent believe a falsehood, even nonverbally ^^
So is the mithril/adamant/pickametal chain a whip? A flail? Nunchuck? I'm not too good with visualizing things on my own. Hopefully we get some in-depth description next time it's used!
I just had a thought- maybe Oceanus isn't just an alicorn, but a SEAPONY alicorn. think about that...
ok, just confirmed i suck at linking. let's try this again.
ReplyDeleteOceanus is the Big Bad of this story.
@The Wandering Magus
ReplyDeleteyou got the html tag right, however you messed up the url somehow
@The Wandering Magus
ReplyDeletewell all of your links work when I'm viewing them through my email, but only your 'big bad' link seem's to work when I'm actually on the page
i think what happened was i forgot to put "http://" in front of the url and so blogger thinks the link is somewhere on EqD's server.
ReplyDelete@The Wandering Magus
ReplyDeleteHis name is kind of a hint here. Also, we have Terrato who is particular found of earth ponies and Celestia who has a thing for unicorns, which would leave Luna and the pegasi... the sisters are tough to catheterize <_<
Visdane said that the technology level would be what he needs it to be in the story so I don't think we will be seeing any monitoring equipment because with that there's just few more steps to F:EQ-ish tech level with magical energy weapons, supercomputers and powered armors. I like the medieval setting better, maybe some steam-powered technology since steam engines are pretty common in Heartland.
I don't know what enchantments on the chain are, we will probably see it in action soon since the squad is about to join the siege of Fangbreaker... but since AJ is pretty good with ropes I suspect she'll just swing it around like a whip or a lasso. Chains used in battle usually have sharp edges or heavy/sharp objects attached to the ends. Nothing like that was described in the previous chapter so I suspect most of the damage will come from the magic within it.
@The Wandering Magus
ReplyDeletejust copy and paste the link from your address bar, that's what I do
@The Wandering Magus
ReplyDelete> I just had a thought- maybe Oceanus isn't just an alicorn, but a SEAPONY alicorn. think about that...
invasion of the seaponies then?
@Adalbertus Morridath
we don't know anything about the chain, beside the fact that it's heavily enchanted, and it's and the word "fine" isn't described, is it "fine" as in well-crafted? or "fine" meaning like a jewelry chain which would make it unsuitable to be a lasso, either way it's only several feet long, though being magic it could expand...or if used to tie someone up it would force them to tell the truth...or just be unbreakable...
this could be the item which inspires rarity to start making/enchanting weapons/armor for her friends
> I had one scene in mind, but it will take some time before I start.
oh, please tell what the scene is
take as long as you need, just wondering though, how long is "some time"?
@stringtheory
ReplyDeleteI think fine in this case refers to the fact that it's made of small links so it feels more like a rope then a chain. Like I said, the enchantments could do anything, from making it light and/or unbreakable to having some kind of additional damage type bonus ( + 2d6 fire damage?).
The picture...well.. I'm not promising anything but I was thinking about the last battle, especially Twilight shielding Pinkie and Fluttershy from Nightmare Moon's attack. I had this scene in mind from the moment I read it, but I haven't yet tried to draw it.
And sea pony invasion wouldn'd go too far... they don't have legs :P
@Adalbertus Morridath
ReplyDelete> I think fine in this case refers to the fact that it's made of small links so it feels more like a rope then a chain.
okay that makes sense
> the enchantments could do anything, from making it light
well the chain has been described as being "lighter then most ropes", but the fact still stands that we don't know much about it and are completely guessing right now
:> The picture [...] Twilight shielding Pinkie and Fluttershy from Nightmare Moon's attack. I had this scene in mind from the moment I read it, but I haven't yet tried to draw it.
that sounds awesome, hope you try to draw it, looking forwards to seeing it if you do decide to draw it
> And sea pony invasion wouldn'd go too far... they don't have legs :P
they would all be transformed into regular ponies by Oceanus, or have some other way to move about on land
Applejack is getting a lot of attention, it seems. Or at least the most memorable attention. Visited, saved, and gifted some kind of shield by the Queen, promoted to Vice Captain, this thing with the chain... though the first two are probably because she's the most stable of the spirits of harmony in this new and volatile setting. I'm hoping their lack of harmony is touched on soon. They were put in a group together specifically because they wield the Elements, but they're incapable of that with the turmoil they're all in. As of right now, their group is only more effective against the Nightmare than others because of Applejack's truth-shield thingy. And even then, it's still arguable wether or not they're better than another Special Operations group, since they're all still recruits. The only one of them who's learned anything beyond the basics of combat is Twilight Sparkle, unless they're all getting inexplicably awesome at fighting while off-screen. I don't know how Terrato, or an officer or something, hasn't at least commented on how they can't currently do the very thing they were all put into a group to do - wield the elements of harmony, specifically against the Nightmare.
ReplyDeleteIt's 2am and I'm pretty much just typing whatever pops into my head. Sorry if any of this comes off as complaining, I'm not meaning for it to, lol. Time for bed.
@Cedric BaleApplejack gets a lot of attention but I think it's mostly to build up to the setting in which Twilight feel threatened by it. I'm actually worried with the lack of attention and development for the other ponies,m especially Pinkie, the less useful pony on the battlefield.
ReplyDeleteAs for the elements of Harmony, I don't know is Visdane plans to somehow use them any time soon or will there be jet another catastrophe during the siege of Fangbreaker that will push them even further apart. Knowing him, it might be the later.
I'm pretty surprised you hinted that dragons and, specifically unicorn, ponies could interbred. I wonder if meeting Seethe Scale would deepen his love interest with rarity?
ReplyDelete@Adalbertus Morridath
ReplyDeleteAbout technology, monitoring equipment was present during "Read it and Weep", as were X-rays or their magical equivalents. As for the weapons, I think having a loose cannon goddess thrown into the War is going to necessitate quite a bit of tech upgrade in the near future. We already have pony golems, Equi Ignei and gods fighting, as well as sunfire being used on the battlefield, so if the other nations don't want to be epically pwnd in this war there's inevitably going to be some sort of escalation/arms race. If nobody wants to break the pact, but at the same time doesn't want something like the last battle to happen to their army, someone's going to want a bigger cannon. Fenrir already has machines of war, and Equestria has fireworks, cannons, and the magical equivalents of guns and bombs on their side, so the options would be either to adapt countermeasures (bypass spells for the fireballs, power armor for the Equi Ignei and golems, Taint for fighting Black Rose, Megaspells for taking down the other gods...) or to become the laughingstock of the Eternal Herd.
The other gods REMEMBER Black Rose and what she did to them. Ursa was actually AFRAID of her and her armies at that time. When they hear that she's back, and has the powers of the SUN GODDESS, and doesn't honor the Pact, don't tell me they won't resort to desperate measures in desperate times.
And as in Fallout Equestria, when the enemy adapts countermeasures, you have to adapt counter-countermeasures. By the time of the Ninth Rebellion, I wouldn't be surprised if we were at FO:E level and slinging megaspells at each other. THAT would get the King's attention like nothing else.
@The Wandering Magus
ReplyDeleteAnd that is precisely something that I'm hoping against. This is not F:EQ, this is a sword and magic type fantasy with a steam engine here and magical device there. With all the mess Black Rose can create, there is just one of her. Terroato still would be her equal and he was fighting In that war long before the pact took place, so one alicorn does not make any difference in the long run. Especially since she may not be all that interested in aiding Equestria in the war efforts.
The technology boost I was talking about was more about introducing new approaches rather than jumping from medieval times to futuristic sf-like weapons just by bringing down the barrier.
And Equi Ignei are gone, they were summoned by Celestia and she no longer has the power to d so. Besides they could not as much as touch any of the mortal ponies because they were forbidden to do so.
Besides, right now we don't even know how much of the technology will Visdane acknowledge in the story. So there probably won't be any electricity or electronic equipment, maybe a steam engine or two and a new school of magic from Hearltand.
By the way, what about zebras? I mean, we have Zecora so there probably are other zebras in Heartland, are there zebras outside of the barrier? How vast the Hearland really is and how many other sentient species live there? I suspect we will have to wait for a Luna-centered chapter to get some answers for that.
I have a feeling that Equestria will have a Gondor Calls for Aid moment and summon allies of zebras and griffons to help them.
ReplyDeleteAlso, who else thinks Big Mac would make a good soldier? He can drag a freaking house. I have a feeling he might show up later in the series, although he'll probably be wanting to stay behind to work the farm.
@The Wandering Magus
ReplyDeletethe Visiden has said the tech level is equal to the requirements of the story, so if the story requires a steam engine to be present, then it will be, anything more advanced (and probably including) than steam engines will probably work on this principle
> We already have pony golems [...]
um, care to point out where in the text this shows up?
> The other gods REMEMBER Black Rose and what she did to them. Ursa was actually AFRAID of her and her armies at that time. When they hear that she's back, and has the powers of the SUN GODDESS, and doesn't honor the Pact, don't tell me they won't resort to desperate measures in desperate times.
we're not even sure what Fenrir, Sesyth, and Arugek are, we do know that Fenrir = Terrato, and the other leaders have the same level of power, but we haven't had much in the way of explanation on what they are, maybe they were followers of Oceanus?
but yes once they hear Black Rose is back and has Celestia's power and is willing to use it, things should get interesting...
@Adalbertus Morridath
>And that is precisely something that I'm hoping against. This is not F:EQ, this is a sword and magic type fantasy with a steam engine here and magical device there.
exactly my thoughts
> Especially since she may not be all that interested in aiding Equestria in the war efforts.
Black Rose has her own, currently unknown, plans, which have something to do with Terrato, her "beloved", but knowing BR, her plans are so genius/complex, we couldn't understand them
> How vast the Hearland really is and how many other sentient species live there?
does "Equestria" in other stories = the heartland? because another fan-fic I'm reading puts Equestria at the size of Africa, but there hasn't been any kind cannon map, and fanon ones vary widely
> I suspect we will have to wait for a Luna-centered chapter to get some answers for that.
yeah, that sounds about right
@Municipal Engines
> I have a feeling that Equestria will have a Gondor Calls for Aid moment and summon allies of zebras and griffons to help them.
well considering the zebra's and the griffon's were inside of the barrier when it got put up, I think that they will just be drafted along with Chosen into the Legion
I think the griffons will be uneasy allies, for now because they probably won't like finding out they were trapped under the barrier as well, possibly without even agreeing to it in the first place
> Also, who else thinks Big Mac would make a good soldier?
strength isn't everything, though it certainly helps, big mac is a unknown in the smarts department, though he doesn't seem any less smart then other ponies, he's just a stallion of few words
well once he hears that Applejack joined the Legion, he'll probably also join along with 80% of the apple family
> although he'll probably be wanting to stay behind to work the farm.
depends on what kind of "draft" it is, if it's a recruiting drive, then he might opt out (but I doubt it), if it's a "everyone who is eligible must join" sort of thing then he won't have a choice, but I doubt it'll come to that, Terrato wanted a reserve army of 100,000 Chosen, within 6 months, so I'll think the Legion will start off with the first way, then move to the second if not enough Chosen sign up
guess what?
ReplyDeletesomeone is making FangBreaker Fortress in minecraft:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9kfWrFsxLR4&feature=related
it's not to scale and isn't finished yet, but it's still awesome!
@stringtheory
ReplyDeleteI actually wanted to make the forttress in minecraft myself :p
also, ponysquare? why not :P
As for Big Mac... Celestia wrote in her edict that one able pony from every family, and the Apple family from Ponyville already has AJ in the legion (as a vice-captain of a Spec Ops squad even) so there is no need to him to join and don't forget that someone has to take care of the farm especially now that probably some of its crops will be acquired by the Legion.
"My cousin's out making a name for himself with the rest of the offensive and what do I end up with? Guarding Princess Pansy."
ReplyDeleteHahaha Skyrim reference :P
@Adalbertus Morridath
ReplyDeletethe whole heartland learning about the legion for the first time thing should be interesting, the closest Legion forces to the heartland were 5 days away back in chapter 48 of Breaking point, so maybe 2-3 days away now?
I guess the question is: will Chosen sign up by the dozens, or will they have to be "persuaded", I think it'll be somewhere in the middle
@Sigurd Mjøllnersson
ReplyDeleteBetter that than an arrow to the knee joke :p
@stringtheory
some of them will probably jump right on the boat just like Twilight did, most of them would probably have some objections but will fulfill their duty and some will probably try to avoid it. it's not like Twilight knew much more about the war when she confronted Celetia about it and she knew what will the more probable outcome be. the big question is, will the message reach to all ponies before first Legionnaires enter Equestria Proper and even if it does, will the legionnaires behave. unlike chosen who simply didn't know anything about the barrier and thus have no prejudices, some barrier land ponies are less than sympathetic towards them and this could lead to unpleasant incidents and in turn active resistance from Heartland ponies. and since I doubt that Legionnaire commanders have extensive diplomatic knowledge and peaceful ways of solving conflicts the first contact might go...well... pretty much like in Terrato's grim predictions. Not to mention that the Prince himself isn't exactly Mr Subtle.
@Adalbertus Morridath
ReplyDelete>Better that than an arrow to the knee joke :p
I'm amazed that with all the crossbow bolts flying around that he hasn't made one yet, I just guess it's a matter of time and weakening willpower on Visiden's part until we see one
> will the message reach to all ponies before first Legionnaires enter Equestria Proper
well the message will probably be distributed by magic, or given to the Legion forces to hand out, so I don't think the heartland not getting the message will be a problem,
>will the legionnaires behave.
well, Prince Terrato did explicitly say that any kind of 'reprisals' from Legionnaires were to be punished severely, so I doubt there will be much overt bad behavior on the part of the Legion.
also, Luna is going along to help with the transition as well, but she's not Celestia, so I doubt she'll put the heartland to ease
plus it should be interesting to watch when the Heartland finds out that Celestia's lost her power
@Adalbertus Morridath
ReplyDeleteYeah, that's the only one Skyrim joke that could work well here. "Let me guess, Someone stole your sweetroll ?" wont work because they dont have thieves in Equestria... as well as "Is that fur? Coming out of your ears?" because they all have fur everywhere =P
@stringtheory
ReplyDeletePony Golems show up in the chapter describing Terrato's fortress. He doesn't trust mortals to take care of it, so he uses living statues powered by his magic.
@Adalbertus Morridath
Recall that last time the gods decided to take part in battle, that is, before the creation of the Pact, entire races were nearly genocided. Corpses to the horizon and back, to the point that even the gods in question were shocked and appalled (and it takes a LOT to shock Fenris and Terrato). You also saw Black Rose essentially curbstomp the entire wolven military singlehoofedly with barely any effort at all. That cost Fenris probably CENTURIES of preparation, generations of carefully bred and trained warriors, and the entire northern front of the war.
With the introduction of the blasting machine making walls and such essentially null, someone's going to go "hey, let's put all this explosive power into a handheld device" and BAM guns. Doesn't mean you lose everything, you just get Renaissance-style warfare instead of strictly medieval. Actually, I'd like to see what WWI style warfare would do to the psychology of the warriors in this world. Honor and mercy go out the window, killing becomes a brutal, efficient and unemotional thing from a kilometer away, and cities as far as the Heartland suddenly have to worry about possibly ceasing to exist in a fiery death without warning.
If every Zebra was like Zecora I have a feeling field medicine would go up like a rocket. A sip of brew to heal a chipped tooth? Upgrade it and you can replace limbs and heal fractures with a vial of potion.
@Black Rose's unknown plans
Nopony and nobody knows her plans, so if I were the enemy I'd assume and prepare for the worst thing that could happen- a goddess not bound by the Pact fully willing and capable to use the Sun to wipe the battlefield of all my soldiers EVERY SINGLE BATTLE. Now who wouldn't start thinking hard about countermeasures?
@Heartland response to draft
imagine for a moment that the UN decides to broadcast, across every form of media imaginable, that since the stone age every single horror story you've ever read was true and the only reason you never found out was because the ones that did find out were dead, the monsters are winning, could kill the average human in a heartbeat and essentially the world is on the verge of being "harvested" in the most horrifying way imaginable. The probable reaction? Riots, civil war, lynch mobs on every street corner, mass suicides and a couple billion conspiracy theorists getting out their shotguns and blasting the head off the next lawmaker they meet. And that's when the shock isn't even that big. Heartland ponies have NEVER faced war, EVER. They've heard fairy tales and stories, sure, but never in the memory of their ancestors for generations has anything CLOSE occurred, due to pacifism spells. Now, as has been stated, the spells are going down PERMANENTLY and in the midst of a CRISIS. I know this isn't supposed to be THAT grimdark, but I can't see this going any way but civil war and a necessary police state. All the Tyrant Celestia myths come true, and in the most horrifyingly realistic way possible. Look at any huge change in history, and you'll find dictators rising after each and every one of them, no matter when or where. I highly doubt anything different is happening here.
@The Wandering Magus
ReplyDelete> Recall that last time the gods decided to take part in battle, that is, before the creation of the Pact, entire races were nearly genocided. […]
True, and Celestia probably never took part in any battle agains any of the enemies and Terrato liked to be i the first like crushing his enemies' skulls rather than tossing megaspells from the back. Still, if it was as simple you'd imagine Celestia would just cast three spells to eradicate enemy armies and have pace and harmony for all ponies instead of the whole barrier business. So I suspect there either are limitations to that power and Fenrir's armies just were completely unprepared because they were in the middle of winning the siege, or Celestias was more dense then a black hole when she got the barrier idea.
> With the introduction of the blasting machine making walls and such essentially null, someone's going to go "hey, let's put all this explosive power into a handheld device" and BAM guns. […]
As far as I remember ponies did not invent gun powder yet. We have magical bombs though and who knows, maybe Zebras have something like that. And even if they have, it took few centuries for Europeans to develop hand-held guns that were more eficient than crossbows, so I don't think we'll see hoof-held rifles any time soon.
> If every Zebra was like Zecora I have a feeling field medicine would go up like a rocket. A sip of brew to heal a chipped tooth? Upgrade it and you can replace limbs and heal fractures with a vial of potion.
Yeah, it all goes down to where main zebra lands are, how the barrier affected them and how will they react to the news.
> @Black Rose's unknown plans [...]
I'm actually thinking that the most logical thing for the two other enemies of Equestria to turn agains Fenrir while he's weakened and grab as much as possible, then wait for Equestria to deal with Black Rose and attack once the inevitable conflict between the alicorns is at its pick. Taking rushed actions now will only help to unify ponies by giving them an enemy.
> @Heartland response to draft [...]
ponies are not humans and like you said, they have no clear knowledge of what war even is. There will be some panic of course and a lot of mistrust towards the other ponies as well as Luna and Celestia, but the civil war scenario is unlikely mainly because there is no history of war they could be inspired with. The worse conflict of recent yeas was solved with apple pies <_< I don't think there will be any violent uprising caused by the revelations of war. If anything, most ponies would take some time for the news to sink in and than either be enraged like Twilight was about the injustice or just scared of the new, unknown war thing that the newcomers talk about. Don't forget that by this point, if everyone knows what happened they should also know that Twilight and her friends joined the effort. And ignoring the completely stupid idea that nobody knows who Twilight is and what she and her friends did for Equestria in the past, having a well known and probably respected pony hero joining the war will be rather inspiring an eye-opening. But like I said, it all depends on how the first contact will be dealt with and how will the legion be acting. It it will look like a hostile takeover than ponies would probably be rather unhappy about that. We'll see in a chapter or two :)
Next chapter will be delayed unfortunately. I have my finals coming up in the next week and I'm procrastinating enough just typing this post down.
ReplyDelete@Visiden Visidane
ReplyDeleteI totally understand, real life study comes before fan-fic writing
though this just gives us more time to over analyze everything
looking forward to seeing a chapter in a couple weeks then :)
ReplyDelete@The Wandering Magus/Adalbertus Morridath
ReplyDelete> He doesn't trust mortals to take care of it, so he uses living statues powered by his magic.
actually, he doesn't want to waste mortal ponies who could be off doing actually useful things, when he can simply use stone constructs
> You also saw Black Rose essentially curbstomp the entire wolven military singlehoofedly with barely any effort at all.
um, I doubt that was the entire wolven military, probably like 1/4-1/3 of it, but yes the power of the demi-gods is amazing (that what I consider the alicorns/the other leaders to be, only the King and Queen are true gods)
> If every Zebra was like Zecora
well Zecora's probably some kind of shaman type, so I doubt every zebra knows alchemy at Zecora's level, but yes having Zebra potions will be a great boon, too bad the northern barrier lands will never see them because the Zebra's are probably down south and thus be drafted to fight against the Ophidus
@Black Rose's unknown plans [...]
all we know about Black Rose's plans is that they involve getting two more ponies to fill the slots for the two dead followers and and her overarching plan involves Terrato, her 'beloved'
@Heartland response to draft [...]
> a lot of mistrust towards the other ponies as well as Luna and Celestia
I wonder what they will do when they find out that Celestia has lost her power?
> The worse conflict of recent yeas was solved with apple pies
this actually shows that the heartland knows how to fight, they just don't have lethal weapons, and oh look, lethal weapons are going to be introduced in a few days, but I doubt many chosen would be willing to take another pony's life...yet, I guess this depends on how the Legion treats the heartland
> If anything, most ponies would take some time for the news to sink in and than either be enraged like Twilight was about the injustice or just scared of the new, unknown war thing that the newcomers talk about.
well I doubt the heartland will be having a war anytime soon within its borders, so for right now it will be a dreadful thing which is used to scare them, some might even question the legitimacy, "how do we know that you're not making this up?"
> Don't forget that by this point, if everyone knows what happened they should also know that Twilight and her friends joined the effort.
well I didn't see any mention of Twilight and her friends joining the Legion in Celestia's letter, so I guess Luna will tell the heartland when she gets there.
> it all depends on how the first contact will be dealt with and how will the legion be acting. It it will look like a hostile takeover than ponies would probably be rather unhappy about that.
yes, the first contact between the heartland and the Legion will be interesting to say the least, plus the heartland finding out that cutie marks are just a way of organization on Celestia's part, will also be interesting
@Adalbertus Morridath
ReplyDeletewell she HAS been pretty dense...
Whenever I see Best Night Ever, Hearth's Warming Eve, Boast Busters, Sweet and Elite and Putting Your Hoof Down, I can't help but think all those fireworks and cannons are gunpowder-based. Also, maybe I'm biased because I'm Asian, but Hand Cannons, regular cannons, mines, bombs and Missile (aka exploding semi-guided rocket-arrow) Racks were around a LONG time ago. You can keep the feudalism and medieval touch (all of Asia certainly did) but still upgrade the weaponry.
Looking forward to chapters on that then :)
True, but the new big girl in town responsible for ruining Fenrir's day should also be up there on the list of priorities, since as far as the enemy knows she's working in favor of Equestria. She might not have gotten west or south yet, but it's only a matter of time, and time is better spent preparing for the inevitable than moving armies a couple week's journey to a location you've never fought in with terrain your soldiers are unfamiliar with, and even if they manage to capture and partition Wolvengard it would take YEARS to properly reconfigure everything for either bears or snakes, years nobody has and a strain on limited resources while Black Rose could be sunfire-blasting your armies to ash without even a messenger left to tell you what went wrong. The same Black Rose that, last time you checked, was one of the most powerful and feared COMMANDERS of the Equestrian Legion. Intel be damned, I do not see the other gods sitting back and putting BR on the back burner and just casually taking over Wolvengard.
The only reason the last conflict was solved with apple pies was because of the pacifism spells, which are GONE, now. It's the same reason there are no murders, barfights, lynchings, mobs, riots, and just about every other human crime imaginable. Take away the spells like she did, and you get our world, aka another Barrier Land, but this time a frustrated, angry, confused Barrier Land facing enemies from within and without. Police State or indiscriminate drafting (which is the same thing) is about the most peaceful solution I can imagine. But, I love being proven wrong in my cynicism by the author, so we'll see. :)
@The Wandering Magus
ReplyDelete> I can't help but think all those fireworks and cannons are gunpowder-based.
um last time I checked, Equestria has something even better then gunpowder: magic, did we ever have sorcerers who could throw around fireballs and lightning? no, but yet Upheaval retains the medieval aspect, despite having magic
> the new big girl in town responsible for ruining Fenrir's day should also be up there on the list of priorities, since as far as the enemy knows she's working in favor of Equestria.
who says that the Ursa and Ophidus even know that BR is back yet? they're not omniscient, and this happened far to the north, where they probably wouldn't have spies, and even still it would take a couple of days to get the message back to their lands
> than moving armies a couple week's journey to a location you've never fought in with terrain your soldiers are unfamiliar with
last time I checked the enemies of equestria have fought each other as much has they've fought the ponies, so I think any kind of offensive would take place over familier terrain
> The same Black Rose that, last time you checked, was one of the most powerful and feared COMMANDERS of the Equestrian Legion.
correction, she was THE most powerful, THE most feared, and THE most brilliant commander of the Equestrian Legion, but she lived 800 years ago, so only Arugek and Sesyth would remember her and when they hear she's back and has the Celestia's power, they'll probably crap their pants
> I do not see the other gods sitting back and putting BR on the back burner
well what else are they suppost to do? finding her is a problem, when she's probably deep in the barrier lands, even if they did find her she could just teleport away, or she could just nuke the forces sent to attack her
> But, I love being proven wrong in my cynicism
I put this story near to the 'light' end of my sliding scale of grimdarkness (yes I made it up right now), it doesn't even register on the grimdark scale in comparison to some other stories (like FO:E and FO:E:PH), if you want grimdark you should read fallout equestria: project horizons, it's at least 2x (this is putting it lightly) more grimdark and mature then the orignal
@stringtheory
ReplyDeleteEven more reason to start industrializing magic. More efficient and usable by Earth Ponies, making your armies that much more lethal in the battlefield. It's like having a legion of strong, flying and missile-launching soldiers all at the same time if you do it correctly. Actually, I'm surprised things HAVEN'T progressed to that stage by now, what with several thousand years of warfare and downtime for escalation and military innovation.
They don't, not yet, but if any of them have flying/scrying units they should know within days. And information on the curbstomp would be number one priority for any surviving messenger/spy/scout, if there were any (and I can't see them NOT having spies/scouts up north to keep tabs on their enemies).
True, but I doubt Ophidus's armies, at least, have gotten to fight in ice and snow conditions for a LONG time (seeing as that Ursa and Equestria are standing between them and Wolvengard) and Ursa still has to deal with both Equestria and Ophidus (and they'd probably get news of the new girl first). After a couple centuries of not having fought you need to retrain soldiers, which takes time few have at the moment.
Exactly
As I said, begin creating countermeasures. Not to assassinate BR herself, but to at least TRY to shield their armies. So as I've said, Bypass Spells to possibly prevent sunfire damage, magically powered armor for stronger individual units, Taint/goddess-maker to try and get back on even footing with Equestria (you get a loose cannon god? Fine, we do too), Megaspells for taking down armies and gods...
It's on my to-read list already :) Pink Eyes is going to be my "recovery" fanfic after that. Then maybe some Fluttermac/Flutterpie/Flutterdash/etc after that to bring me all the way back to the land of the normal... well, semi-normal :D
@The Wandering Magus
ReplyDeleteGood luck Visdane, take your time, real life is always more important than fanfics :D
Fireworks, right, I forgot they have those in Equestria <_<
I don't know how will everything to on from this point and quite frankly I'd rather be surprised. One thing is for sure, it won't be pretty but I hope it won't be as bad as it could go. You're mixing Fallout: Equestria with Upheaval a lot. We don't even know what kind of magic the other races have. Unicorn magic looks pretty unique as far as I can tell and we don't even know if it's possible to harvest it to power things (ok, in canon we know it's possible to power machines, but it all depends on whatever Visdane wants to do with it). As for other races, we don't know much about them. Wolven have some kind of shamanistic magic and Fenrir can create blizzards and affect morale, but other than that, we don't know anything. They also don't have anything more advanced than siege towers and catapults. And if you're surprised that the technology was stagnant for a thousand years at least, see European dark ages. It's a roughly 1000 years of moderate improvement in a construction of a sword and the next 500 years took us form that to atomic arsenal that can start nuclear winter 11 times or so.
I still haven't finish Fallout Equestria, not to mention the sequels... it just got so long and boring that reading it stopped being any pleasure. I know this is completely off topic but are the spinoffs/sequels any good?
@Adalbertus Morridath
ReplyDelete> I don't know how will everything to on from this point and quite frankly I'd rather be surprised.[...]
you said it better then I could've
> I still haven't finish Fallout Equestria, not to mention the sequels... it just got so long and boring that reading it stopped being any pleasure. I know this is completely off topic but are the spinoffs/sequels any good?
yea, FOE does drag on a bit, and some don't like the ending (I though it was okay)
let's see I've read two FOE spinoffs: project horizons and Pinkeyes
let's see project horizons is the most grimdark story I've ever read, a couple of times I've had to stop reading mid-chapter and walk away, just to get my faith in humanity/ponykind back, it's at least twice as grimdark/mature as FO:E, and contains 5x as many dark secrets, a very good read, would recommend it to anyone who can deal with very mature themes (suicide, rape, and child mortality, to name a few)
pink eyes is the story of quite possibly the most ignorant filly ever, it's a light hearted take on the wasteland, the grimdark is there, it's just ignored/misinterpreted by puppysmiles (the name of the filly), you should read if regular FO:E/FO:E:PH is too grimdark/mature for you, or if you need to recover from the grimdarkness of another FO:E fic
I made the mistake of reading pinkeyes before project horizons, so I can't use it as my "recovery" read like Magnus is planning on doing, wish I had been smarter and read PH before pink eyes, but I didn't know what I was getting into with project horizons
@stringtheory
ReplyDeleteTo be honest I wasn't even slightly bothered with Fallout Equestria's qrimdarkness. The biggest challenge was not skipping the Canterlot part, but not because of all the grimdark monstrosities, that was actually the reason I didn't skip it, the problem was that I couldn't see any reason for that part. I said it before, the main problem of tat story is almost forcing the abuse Littlepip goes through over and over for the sake of abuse and nowhere it's more obvious than in the Canterlot part. It was almost exactly like a long and repetitive dungeon section of an RPG when your party of choice is 10 levels above most enemies, but you forgot to take enough health potions :p
in fact Upheaval is more engaging because of a much deeper emotional engagement I have with characters and the way the grimdarkness is affecting them. Littlepip (and don't get me wrong, I really like her, she's basically my original Fallout character up to the skill set) turning into a killing machine wasn't as engaging as Applejack's struggle not to become one herself.
From what you wrote I might actually read Project Horizon, is it as ungodly long as the original FO:E?
But enough about the *competition* :p
a random thought: if you'd be able to create an OC pony for Upheaval, or yourself ponified or something, would you go for a chosen or a barrier land pony?
@Adalbertus Morridath
ReplyDelete> I wasn't even slightly bothered with Fallout Equestria's grimdarkness.
I wasn't either when I read FO:E, but project horizons did bother me because of all the mature themes and the general grimdarkness is increased by 200%
> in fact Upheaval is more engaging because of a much deeper emotional engagement I have with characters and the way the grimdarkness is affecting them.
then you'll like PH, the characters are always trying to deal with/understand the grimdark wasteland, and everyone has at least 3 dark secrets
though in upheaval, the main6 adjusted pretty darn fast to the whole "world which we're not suppost to know about, because it's grimdark", though I guess it was a case of survival, it will be interesting to see how the heartland finds out about the barrier lands, when their lives aren't being threatened, like the main6 were
> is it as ungodly long as the original FO:E?
eeyup, it's already longer then the original (which was long then war&peace), and it's only four chapters past the halfway point
> if you'd be able to create an OC pony for Upheaval, or yourself ponified or something, would you go for a chosen or a barrier land pony?
barrier land definitely, why would I want to live in a perfect world (or at least pretty darn close to perfect), that was really just a lie?
i'd choose to be a crippled-from-birth barrier land with a long line of descent from either Starswirl the Bearded or Clover the Clever. The cripple part keeps me out of the military long enough to have a chance, but the ancestry could potentially make me an invaluable asset enough that I'm not just a random civilian to slaughter when bored. given a few decades of study, dank tower or not, as well as gradual challenges and i can go the quadratic wizard route- you show me your fireball, I show you my gravitation field. You raise your sunfire, I raise my matter-to-energy conversion spell matrix. I'd rather be a wimpy unicorn nerd with a homemade balefire machinegun than the most badass legionnaire in the history of equestria. a couple of decades of invention and study, and i might even ascend, assuming i'm careful enough that Terrato doesn't build me my grave and crush me with it.
ReplyDeleteoh! and by the way:
ReplyDeleteTrixie: Illusion magic, lockpicking and espionage. Crowd Control/rogue
Zecora: potions, alchemy, poison- assassination of vital government leaders and interrogation of Celestian loyalists, strength, dexterity, power, stamina and healing potions, decent illusions. Buffer/crowd control.
Gilda: mercenary assassin, large damage output and excellent speed. Rogue.
Flim and Flam: engineers and mechanics, artillery, power armor, tanks, Gatling guns, anything steampunk. Ranged.
Iron Will: large muscle mass and thick skin, good at tanking. Tank.
Discord: god-tier powers, should take on most anything (and I do mean anything) with little more than a snap and a chuckle. "I WIN" card.
Big Mac: god-tier strength. Tank/damage output. Can take on a small battalion singlehoofedly, drag a full-size house and knock down walls with little effort when motivated. Warrior/tank.
Twilight Sparkle: near-god-tier magic. Fireball, telekinesis, mind rape, transfiguration, transmutation, telefragmentation. Mage/ranged.
Rarity: near-god-tier telekinesis. Subatomic manipulation, illusion, destruction/manipulation/control of internal organs, lockpicking. Rogue.
Pinkie: god-tier fourth wall and dexterity. Offscreen teleportation, walking on air, hammerspace, elastic body, cartoon invulnerability, mindreading, precognition. Pinkamena: psychotic assassin interrogator. High weapon proficiency and extensive knowledge of anatomy, ability to metabolize inedible matter, high pain threshold and ability to inflict massive amounts of pain and damage. Rogue/bard.
Applejack: as shown. Warrior/tank.
Rainbow Dash: god-tier speed. Large area effect abilities, electricity, weather manipulation, shockwave abilities. Possibly tornado, hurricane, blizzard, firestorm and earthquake generation abilities. If she can move fast enough, time travel abilities. Rogue.
Fluttershy: wide and varied mind and medicine abilities. Willbreaker/Mind Control Stare, extensive knowledge of anatomy, ability to immobilize or otherwise incapacitate opponents, ability to command Everfree creatures, high strength, almost god-tier speed when motivated, extreme resistance to manipulation. Buffer/crowd control/beastmaster/druid/rogue.
Spike: all known dragon capabilities. Ranged/Tank/Warrior.
@The Wandering Magus
ReplyDeleteTL;DR
but really, not a bad analyze of the characters
I assume the the top seven are BR's group? because a bunch of them wouldn't make sense, Big Mac, really? Zecora? I know BR is a god-level manipulator but that's pushing it a little too far in my opinion
@stringtheory
ReplyDelete> though in upheaval, the main6 adjusted pretty darn fast to the whole "world which we're not suppost to know about, because it's grimdark"
I wouldn't say they adjusted themselves as much as they (at least Twilight) had the strong conviction and motivation to do what must be done. And don't forget they did not find themselves alone in a hostile wasteland, they joined an organized military force and revived a training as well as equipment and support.
> eeyup, it's already longer then the original (which was long then war&peace), and it's only four chapters past the halfway point
well... that complicates things, because I don't really have that much of a free time.
> barrier land definitely, why would I want to live in a perfect world (or at least pretty darn close to perfect), that was really just a lie?
So you can join the Legion once the barrier is down and show what chosen are really made of? :p
@The Wandering Magus
As much as I like the idea, I'm again conflicted about the nature of magic in Upheaval-verse :p
as for me... I have two conflicting ideas who would I like to be... actually not so much who, but the background. Unicorn in both cases, with particular talent in freezing spells (anti Pyre Valor :p ), either a chosen pony from Heartland who sort of reluctantly joins the legion or a legionnaire with bear claw wound where his cutie mark should be. The first background would highly depend on the future events, the later pretty much being about rising through the ranks to join SpecOps squad at some point :p also, possibly it could be a mare since I'm weird like that and most of my characters are females (usually in gamse, If I have to watch someone's back side for 30-something hours it's better be nice and curvy :p)
@Adalbertus Morridath
ReplyDelete> I wouldn't say they adjusted themselves as much as they (at least Twilight) had the strong conviction and motivation to do what must be done.
yeah, that makes sense
> they did not find themselves alone in a hostile wasteland, they joined an organized military force and revived a training as well as equipment and support.
and yet the existence of said organized military, didn't also blow their minds, I guess the existence of the royal guards helped with this
> well... that complicates things, because I don't really have that much of a free time.
yeah it took 90% of one week's free time for me to catch up, and I have a lot of free time
> So you can join the Legion once the barrier is down and show what chosen are really made of? :p
and have the world turn out to be a lie, no thank you
> as for me... I have two conflicting ideas who would I like to be...
wow, I can't even make up a simple OC, all my head stories keep me as human for some reason and I'm a marty stu
@stringtheory
ReplyDeletenah, top seven are just side characters and bottom seven are main characters. copy/pasted from a comment i wrote on a Nightmare Sun fanfic and forgot Celestian Loyalists were good guys (kinda) in this setting; all fourteen were supposed to be working together and settling differences to fight the common enemy. Speaking of which, now that the Heartland is open I hope to see any of the top seven show up at some point, and if they do anythhing remotely like what I suggested intentional or not i'll fangasm over it :D
but yeah, back on topic, my original point was that war was all about efficiency and countering enemy strengths, and nothing does that better than industrialization.
@ Visiden Visidane Could I ask You to upload all chapters on Google Docs? Many authors seem to do it and many fans (me for example) enjoy downloading fanfics to their hard drives =P
ReplyDelete@Sigurd Mjøllnersson
ReplyDeleteThey're already uploaded to FimFiction, which also lets you download the chapters, if that helps.
Here's a link.
@Visiden, will the EQD link be kept to fanfiction.net, changed to fimfiction or will there be links to both?
ReplyDeletePersonally, I hope he asks EQD to add a second link pointing to Upheaval on FimFiction. They've done that for other fanfics, I doubt they'd mind, especially considering they won't need to update the link every update, lol.
ReplyDeleteDid anyone else got the "Everyone in Canterlot knows Twilight Sparkle" moment when they were sneaking into the archives in the newest episode? :p
ReplyDeletealso, apparently, Twilight knows Lorentz transformation, which allows to account for time dilatation effects in general theory of relativity.
photographic evidence
my thoughts on the new chapter:
ReplyDeletemore backstory on scarlet rabbit, this explains a lot about why he's so crazy, and why he tried to kill Overcast after he won the race, I guess if you won you got to kill your opponent
Rainbow Dash is trying to make up for her previous failing, this should be interesting and probably will result in her getting nearly killed, accepting Scarlet Rabbit's challenge to a race will probably be the thing which gets her nearly killed
the overall grimdarkness of the barrier lands/the story as gone up with the inclusion of what the Ophidites are doing
Pinkie knows she's useless on the front line...but apparently she can channel "ley energy", whatever that is...hope she can learn more about this, plus these "true earth ponies" sound very interesting (yay, hearts warming eve reference, the way Visiden works stuff from the show into his grimdark world is amazing)
the barrier lands are full of some very interesting ponies, the "true earth ponies" are probably a reference to something, I don't know what though...
Pegasi not being able to control the weather in the barrier lands is now canon (it was kinda said before, but wasn't very clear), I wonder what will happen to controlling the weather in the heartland now that the barrier is down?
we still don't have the chapter when the heartland finds out about the war, either Visiden's stalling because it's really hard to write (which I can understand), or it will happen "off-camera", which I hope it won't because that would just be a cop-out on his part
Yay
ReplyDeleteCharacter development!
Kinda
so, Rainbow is still a moron... I suppose that's just staying true to herself:P there is no guessing now, there will be trouble in the future, big trouble.
And Pinkie... and a sect of earth ponies who hate other ponies and can use the same kind of magic the pinkie sense works with. As much as I'd like to hope it's a good third that Pinkie might be getting some help with developing her talents and...you know, be useful. This is, however, another thing that will go the wrong way.
So instead of building harmony we have RD doing exactly the opposite of what everyone asked and told her not to do and pinkie who might get herself involved in a racist sect of earth ponies who will most likely drag her away from her friends. ~yay~
and we also have Scarlet's backstory... selectively bred and conditioned slave turned legionnaire who needs to race and wants to be defeated... and now I understand why. He wants to louse so that the reason he was made for could no longer apply to him. He's still a slave to his abilities, he was made as a winner, the fastest and as long as he reminds as such, he cannot be truly free. Suddenly, I desire his death a little bit less. Good work :D
also, a big d'aww for Tailwind to watch over her husband :D
@stringtheory
> Pegasi not being able to control the weather in the barrier lands is now canon (it was kinda said before, but wasn't very clear), I wonder what will happen to controlling the weather in the heartland now that the barrier is down?
Only their lack of involvement is canon, they probably still could do that given the right training and infrastructure, but they have other things to do, like, you know, war :p
And from previous experiences, I think Visdane is just waiting for a good cliffhanger moment to jump to Heartland for a chapter or two :p
I commited anther picture, this time a remake of the first one: http://adalbertus.deviantart.com/#/d4skmxt
ReplyDeletebecause, surprisingly, it was actually popular...
hmmm... slightly over 3 months and I can see some improvements :)
@Adalbertus Morridath
ReplyDeleteanother awesome pic for my really-should-become-the-title-image folder
@Adalbertus Morridath
ReplyDelete> so, Rainbow is still a moron... I suppose that's just staying true to herself:P there is no guessing now, there will be trouble in the future, big trouble.
well, in her eyes she still has to redeem herself and she's (slowly) subscribing to the idea of death before dishonor which Vanguard (and Pyre) also subscribe to, you tend to see it in medieval/feudalistic settings, especially if the setting is grimdark (see warhammer 40k, where it's one of the central pillars of honor in the imperium)
> So instead of building harmony we have RD doing exactly the opposite of what everyone asked and told her not to do and pinkie who might get herself involved in a racist sect of earth ponies who will most likely drag her away from her friends. ~yay~
don't you love this story?
> Suddenly, I desire his death a little bit less.
he's a tortured soul (damn, no trope) how can you not feel a little bit sorry for him?
> Only their lack of involvement is canon
okay, I'll give you that, but I think even if they didn't do weather control, they would at least know that they had it, unless they've forgotten...
@stringtheory
ReplyDelete> well, in her eyes she still has to redeem herself and she's (slowly) subscribing to the idea of death before dishonor which Vanguard (and Pyre) also subscribe to, you tend to see it in medieval/feudalistic settings, especially if the setting is grimdark (see warhammer 40k, where it's one of the central pillars of honor in the imperium)
hmmm
"one of my best friends got critically injured saving me when I was recklessly playing a hero... I have to play hero some more to show them how much I care" - makes perfect sense <_<
The Imperium is a little bit different because they clone their elite troops and indoctrinate the rest... and they worship a corpse stuffed in a piece of machine nobody even knows actually does anything at this point :p
> don't you love this story?
Yes, yes I do :D
> he's a tortured soul (damn, no trope) how can you not feel a little bit sorry for him?
He attacked Fluttershy and is most probably a romantic interest for RD somewhere in the future(if he won't kill her first that is), what more do I need to hate him? :p
> okay, I'll give you that, but I think even if they didn't do weather control, they would at least know that they had it, unless they've forgotten...
Like I said few posts back, they probably never got the idea that they might want to control weather.
and I'm glad you like the picture :D
@Adalbertus Morridath
ReplyDelete> "one of my best friends got critically injured saving me when I was recklessly playing a hero... I have to play hero some more to show them how much I care" - makes perfect sense <_<
this IS Rainbow Dash we're talking about here...and it's more like: "one of my best friends got critically injured saving me when I was recklessly playing a hero...I have to be a hero some more to get them to respect me again."
> The Imperium is a little bit different because they clone their elite troops
not to turn this into a 40k argument, but since when did the Imperium clone Space Marines? (last time I checked, that was from star wars...)
> He attacked Fluttershy and is most probably a romantic interest for RD somewhere in the future(if he won't kill her first that is), what more do I need to hate him? :p
the attacking part Fluttershy could be partly due to his time as a slave and she was using the Stare on him and what's so bad about RD having a romantic interest? plus if RD wins the race, that might be a jumping off point for a relationship, but if she loses...(which she probably will)
> they probably never got the idea that they might want to control weather.
but wouldn't they at least know that they HAVE this ability? it's not like they don't have any free time
plus I wonder what will happen to the wonderbolts? they're the best stunt fliers in the heartland (and are the equivalent of special forces in most fan-fics that have wars/violence in them) so them plus the Legion should be interesting
> I'm glad you like the picture :D
can't wait to see more ;)
@stringtheory
ReplyDelete> this IS Rainbow Dash we're talking about here...and it's more like: "one of my best friends got critically injured saving me when I was recklessly playing a hero...I have to be a hero some more to get them to respect me again."
And it still doesn't make sense :p
> not to turn this into a 40k argument, but since when did the Imperium clone Space Marines? (last time I checked, that was from star wars...)
Maybe not the best choice of words. Not all of them are clones, but all of them are genetically enhanced and made more to the image of the chapter's Primarch. And those falling in battle often get cloned. And I think there is one chapter that consists mostly of clones or something :p
> the attacking part Fluttershy could be partly due to his time as a slave and she was using the Stare on him
I know, that's why I hate him a little bit less now :P
> and what's so bad about RD having a romantic interest?
because everyone knows she loves Applejack.... /joke :p
I just don't like him and I like RD, so I don't want her to end up with a pony I don't like. It's a completely subjective and biased opinion :p
> plus if RD wins the race, that might be a jumping off point for a relationship, but if she loses...(which she probably will)
yeah, she probably will...
> but wouldn't they at least know that they HAVE this ability? it's not like they don't have any free time
it's not like they have magical weather controlling powers, they can just manipulate clouds which leads to techniques of controlling cluud cover and stuff. If such techniques, as well as the entire infrastructure like Cloudsdale's weather factory were never developed in the barrier lands there is no way for pegasi to actually control weather. But the ability is still there.
> can't wait to see more ;)
working on it. Not necessary Upheaval fanart, but something is coming :p
Scarlet Rabbit was definitely acting very creepy towards RD. Holding her really tightly and grinning and staring at her.
ReplyDeleteAlso, just to add fuel to your shipping, RD did say: "It wasn't Scarlet's drinking ability or even his skill at fighting that Rainbow admired but she wasn't ready to talk to anypony about that." So she might harbour a tiny bit of a crush on Scarlet, which would be hilarious.
I'll leave you guys to debate that.
@Adalbertus Morridath
ReplyDelete>And it still doesn't make sense :p
eeyup but that's what being in a warzone does to you, especially knowing that one of your best friends almost died because of something you did, and the guilt transforms into feelings of "they don't think, I'm good enough" therefore you think you have to prove yourself to them
> made more to the image of the chapter's Primarch.
I know that before the Horus Hersey, some legions might have done the "look more like the Primarch"
> And those falling in battle often get cloned.
Never heard of fallen Marines getting cloned, and I've read a fair number of 40k books
>And I think there is one chapter that consists mostly of clones or something :p
that would be the Alpha Legion and I don't think they did clones but they all did look like their Primarch, to be able to be body doubles for him and be more secrets and lies in general (how can you tell who's who when they all look alike?)
just my 40k fanboy acting up, it's the only other universe I consider myself a fanboy of
>I know, that's why I hate him a little bit less now :P
eh, I never hated him, he was too crazy and awesome (emphasis on the crazy) for me to hate, plus his dark and troubled past, just makes him an even more interesting character in my eyes.
> yeah, she probably will...
maybe if he wins he won't kill/hurt Rainbow, because of the feelings he has for her or he could just realize that what he's doing is wrong and that he can control himself, or he'll stop himself mid-beat up and have said realization.
> they can just manipulate clouds which leads to techniques of controlling cloud cover and stuff
then why hasn't it come up yet? plus cloud would be a pretty good building material
@Municipal Engines
> Scarlet Rabbit was definitely acting very creepy towards RD. Holding her really tightly and grinning and staring at her.
well he did the aerial equivalent of dragging her into a dark corner, and wanting to tell her something that nopony else is suppost to know, plus he's also crazy
> So she might harbor a tiny bit of a crush on Scarlet, which would be hilarious.
and so the plot thickens
@stringtheory
ReplyDelete> eeyup but that's what being in a warzone does to you, especially knowing that one of your best friends almost died because of something you did, and the guilt transforms into feelings of "they don't think, I'm good enough" therefore you think you have to prove yourself to them
yeah, but it doesn’t make sense.
> I know that before the Horus Hersey, some legions might have done the "look more like the Primarch"
It wasn’t as much as looking like the primarch as having his genes implanting Or something. My knowledge comes mostly from a friend I have who played the games (including the original) so I might not remember everything correctly, but
there was cloning and gene theorapy included somewhere, I’m sure of it :p
> maybe if he wins he won't kill/hurt Rainbow, because of the feelings he has for her or he could just realize that what he's doing is wrong and that he can control himself, or he'll stop himself mid-beat up and have said realization.
Or maybe he wins and starts beating the crap out of RD, or worse, but I don’t think this story is that grimdark, and then someone interferes and he runs away and than joins Black Rose because she manipulates him and promises something in return.
> > So she might harbor a tiny bit of a crush on Scarlet, which would be hilarious.
> and so the plot thickens
Eeeyup, she most definitely have a crush on him, she might not be fully aware of it but it’s there.
Ok, new topic: final battle with NMM take two :D we know pyre will be much less compliant in defending the fortress, she’ll most probably only fight Twilight and most probably only because now she wants to be defeated as per her agreement with Moonshadow spirit. Your thoughts?
No one thinks that Rainbow stands a chance? Poor filly.
ReplyDelete@Visiden Visidane
ReplyDeleteIt's not like we don't think she could win, it's just that we know you :P Besides, it's always better to be pleasantly surprised than disappointed... and yes, I do hope, for what it's worth, that she will somehow win. To be honest, the threat of slow and painful death might be enough to push her to do the sonic rainboom.
But until that they have Nightmare Moon/Pyre to deal with and with current lack of harmony and less than a week or relative rest and training, I don't think the battle could go much better this time.
How's the real life stuff, by the way?
And how do you like the new pic? :D
@Adalbertus Morridath
ReplyDelete> yeah, but it doesn’t make sense
and who said it had to?
> It wasn’t as much as looking like the primarch as having his genes implanting Or something.
well there's the gene-seed, which is a bunch of extra organs/implants which made you into a badass space marine
> he runs away and than joins Black Rose because she manipulates him and promises something in return.
I didn't even think of that, that would be interesting...
> Eeeyup, she most definitely have a crush on him, she might not be fully aware of it but it’s there.
I think she's just realizing it
> we know pyre will be much less compliant in defending the fortress
and once she finds out that the barrier is down and the heartland is joining the war, she might even start actively resisting Nightmare Moon, which should be interesting...
I think this chapter is a good place to jump to some other place, because in my head the foreshadowing is just asking for a jump to somewhere else, rather then continuing the current plot line of retaking fangbreaker/main6
@stringtheory
ReplyDelete> and who said it had to?
I was just pointing out the flaw in her line of reasoning :p
> I didn't even think of that, that would be interesting...
really? That was like the first thing that came to my mind when Black Rose said about recruiting new lieutenants, I just didn't see any reason why he'd switch sides until now.
> and once she finds out that the barrier is down and the heartland is joining the war, she might even start actively resisting Nightmare Moon, which should be interesting...
she'd still want to kill Twilight, so it all comes down to either letting herself be killed because she realizes that it's the only way to stop nightmare moon, or giving up all she used to stand for as a legionnaire to kill Twilight.
> I think this chapter is a good place to jump to some other place, because in my head the foreshadowing is just asking for a jump to somewhere else, rather then continuing the current plot line of retaking fangbreaker/main6
maybe... but probably not cliffhangery enough :P
This fic is nothing short of fantastic. It's rich and compelling and everyone is thrown way out of their comfort zone. Intrigue, action, costly mistakes, I love it all, it's beautifully written. You've just started the second story, and I can't wait to read it all. Thank you so much for sharing this masterpiece.
ReplyDeleteEdit chapter 2: Yes, more! I wish this story lasts forever. Thanks!
Edit chapter 3: You write *fast*. Dash's pride will be her undoing. We know what will happen if she loses. But what happens if she *wins*? I'm glad Pinkie Pie found a roundabout way to be useful; never underestimate Pinkie Sense! And I'm very excited for round 2. Thanks for writing!
I'm wondering if Rainbow Dash will confront Scarlet about the whole "almost killing Overcast because he lost" thing or not. It would seem the prudent thing to do, although it might just tick him off. I don't know, he seems to like her enough to probably at least try and resist the urge to kill her if she loses or pisses him off.
ReplyDelete@Adalbertus Morridath
ReplyDelete> That was like the first thing that came to my mind when Black Rose said about recruiting new lieutenants, I just didn't see any reason why he'd switch sides until now.
hmm, my mind jumped to the heartland and Trixie, but yes I can see Scarlet Rabbit almost killing RD then fleeing and being recruited by Black Rose, and Vanguard being crushed by the fact that both of his former squad mates went traitor, causing him to need a shoulder to lean on and possibly doubting himself...
> so it all comes down to either letting herself be killed because she realizes that it's the only way to stop nightmare moon, or giving up all she used to stand for as a legionnaire to kill Twilight.
well, the legion would kill her as soon as they get their hoofs on her because she went traitor in the highest degree, so I don't see what she has to lose by giving up what she stood for as a legionnaire, I just think the relationship between her and Nightmare Moon will become more strained,until they find a cause they can "agree" on again, which will probably be eradicating Chosen, starting with Twilight and the other main6,
plus, how much control does NMM have over Pyre? from what it looked like NMM can take full control if the possessed is willing
> maybe... but probably not cliffhangery enough :P
yeah, but it's definitely foreshadowery enough ;)
@stringtheory
ReplyDelete> hmm, my mind jumped to the heartland and Trixie,
too easy and too predictable :P
> but yes I can see Scarlet Rabbit almost killing RD then fleeing and being recruited by Black Rose, and Vanguard being crushed by the fact that both of his former squad mates went traitor, causing him to need a shoulder to lean on and possibly doubting himself...
not to mention RD herself having a hard time because of it.... being nearly killed could also make her feel bad <_<
> well, the legion would kill her as soon as they get their hoofs on her because she went traitor in the highest degree, so I don't see what she has to lose by giving up what she stood for as a legionnaire, I just think the relationship between her and Nightmare Moon will become more strained,until they find a cause they can "agree" on again, which will probably be eradicating Chosen, starting with Twilight and the other main6,
the only reason Pyre agreed t that arrangement is because she was sure the Legion would survive and push Fenrir's army out of Equestria... that and the fact that a serious crisis could force Celestia or Terrato to act, bring down the barrier and stuff. And since that's exactly what happened and all her goals, except for killing Twilight, are now fulfilled the deal is off. she's not a stupid pony, she knows Nightmare Moon has to be stopped and she also knows she's a traitor even if she had good intentions. And since she want Legion to win and she was willing to sacrifice her life in her original plans there is almost nothing stopping her from doing so in a way that would take Nightmare moon with her... nothing except her feelings toward Twilight.
Maybe we'll have a typical "there is still good in you" scene (I know there's a trope for that, I just can't be bothered looking for it) - that could account for the lack of harmony between the elements of Harmony... but that's just my guess.
Copypasting from my comment over at fimfiction, had similar thoughts as both of you so far but ill try integrating into the discussion in some later post, maybe.
ReplyDeleteIm hoping for some sort of acknowledgement of the fact that, regardless of beliefs, pegasi continue to be able to sit on, "milk", move and shape clouds, even in the barrier lands. That should allow control of the weather, regardless of beliefs, if they just tried. I'm also awaiting word on pinkie's teleportation, fourth wall, shapeshifting, contortionist and bard powers. And i do mean powers, just read any fanfic or watch the series over again. In war, offscreen teleportation, hammerspace, charisma (already shown), and rubber limbs, if not limited to rule of funny, are near-demigodlike powers, and would give her actual advantages as the group progresses to more powerful enemies.
Fluttershy's Stare, liberated from simple emergency use by Iron will, as well as her druid abilities should be equally helpful in crowd control and summoning.
That would finally allow the "useless" members of the mane six to start participating in earnest rather than being lumped into The Load, which would really disappoint me.
Notmally i would be inclined to say Dash's sonic rainboom and rainnuke would make her op if unlocked from their place as last resorts, but as with Pimkie and Fluttershy's normally op powers, war is the great equalizer, and Scarlet is already borderline Marty Stu, so I'd say give Dash all the advantages you can.
As a "normal" earh pony without magic or flight or the fourth wall, this would leave Applejack nearly useless, so slowly removing Truth-realted abilities (shield of truth, Truthsight, living lie detector, dispell charm, dispell illusion, etc) would make the mane six balanced given what they have to deal with out here. It would also mqke them ponies worthy of being calledelements of harmony. Otherwise, the six would just become a troupe of useless, angsty background characters while overpowered oc's took center stage. And that would be quite a tragedy.
Regardless, however, i cannot say i don't enjoy the story; in fact, i love the work done so far. It just seems my two favorite ponies are being brushed aside, and i've come to expect much more. Keep up the good work!
*meant to say "limits to Truth-related abilities" not the abilities.
ReplyDelete@The Wandering Magus
ReplyDeleteI don't see why pegasi couldn't do that.
Pinkie's reality-bending powers are there for comic purposes only, so I don't think anything more than the Pinkie sense will be canon in the story. Or it will be as a part of whatever witchcraft the true earth ponies do :P
but I'm betting for pinkie sense and charisma/morale boost only.
Fluttershy probably never met Iron Will in this universe, so if we'll ever see her mastering the Stare, it would be because of something else (the good old doctor maybe?)
I wouldn't want AJ to have too many truth-based powers. One is enough. Whatever other abilities she might have, would be based on her hard work, determination and earth pony stubbornness... see Batman :P
@The Wandering Magus
ReplyDeleteYou seem to be thinking that I can and will apply every little detail from the show into the fic.
I can't and I won't. There simply some details that I have to adjust.
Take for example Twilight's ability to take an anvil, a piano and a wagon of hay to the head without being reduced to a red stain on the ground. Following that logic, thirty lashes or a pounding from Pyre Valor should be nothing more than gnat bites. I don't see anyone calling me out on that.
Making the mane 6 into combat machines is not a primary concern for me. It is not their abilities that should define them but the paths they take and how they take them. I do understand that Fluttershy, Pinkie Pie and Rarity receive less screen time than Twilight Sparkle, Rainbow Dash and Applejack. Putting them on equal footing when it comes to combat is not the solution I'm looking for.
Didn't see the point in "Putting your Hoof Down" where Iron Will gave Fluttershy the ability to use the stare at will. If he did, she should be paying him then because his methods worked to a degree. What I got from that episode was that Fluttershy discovered that she should find her own path to assertiveness and nothing more. As for her having druid abilities, I think that's an overestimation of her influence on animals. We've seen that they do disobey her, take advantage of her and are sometimes fearful of her, she certainly has no power over plants and I don't see her using Wild Shape any time soon.
@Adalbertus
Like the new picture. More detailed than the first version. You do make ponies more pony-like than the show portrays them but I think this has been mentioned by someone else before.
@Visiden Visidane
ReplyDeleteI'm still working on making my ponies more...well... marshmallow-y... but I actually like them with a little bit more details.
@Adalbertus Morridath
ReplyDeleteI like the bottom three the best.
Although, you do seem to show Twilight crying quite a lot. :D
@The Wandering Magus
ReplyDeletedamn, somehow cleared my super long comment responding to you (as Dery would say, I just don't know what went wrong), but here's the really short version: What Visiden said, (started writing my response very soon after you posted your comment and got ninja'd by Visiden)
I have to re-post this comment from FiMfiction here, it's just too awesome, all credit goes to ILSS:
ReplyDeleteWhat's that, Dash? You need to perform some foolhardy heroics to prove yourself and make up for that time one of your best friends had to be saved by divine intervention because you got her killed trying to perform some foolhardy heroics to prove yourself?
I know! Why not accept that challenge from the guy you got your friend killed trying to impress? The crazy one that your superiors and friends all warned you to steer clear of. You know, the visibly deranged lunatic who tried to kill the last guy he raced? Who's on his last strike before they put him down like a rabid dog, as a public service? The guy who's fast enough to snatch you from the head of the march without anyone noticing, and strong enough that he can overpower you without any visible effort on his part, all while wearing armor? And hey, he doesn't want any witnesses – that's cool, right?
Meanwhile, Pinkie is attracting Earth Pony supremacists. Their sect has turned their backs even on their own kind in the past, so I expect their loyalty to the well-being of Equestria is less than certain. I doubt Pinkie would give up her friends just to please some bigoted strangers – rather, I think it's more likely that they won't be willing to leave a pony of her talents amongst... undesirable influences.
@stringtheory
ReplyDeleteyeah, that's what I said :P
I kinda want to see more of Fenrir, for some reason. Perhaps seeing what his feelings towards Luna actually are; whether he just wants her as a pretty little toy or whether he actually wants her as a proper wife.
ReplyDelete@Municipal Engines
ReplyDelete> I kinda want to see more of Fenrir
he's an interesting character, yeah, seeing more of him would be interesting, the opposing leaders are an unknown right now to us so fleshing them out would be good
> Perhaps seeing what his feelings towards Luna actually are; whether he just wants her as a pretty little toy or whether he actually wants her as a proper wife.
yeah that would be interesting to find out, back in chapter 27 of Breaking Point, when Luna agreed to marry Fenrir, but was interrupted by "Celestia", Fenrir said that the wolven not attacking Equestria would be a part of their wedding vows in Wolvengard, so he at least wanted it to be semi-legitimate, but what he does with her afterwards...
o…kay that was unexpected in so many ways.
ReplyDeleteWell, not all, I knew Pyre would do anything for Nightmare Moon to be killed.
What I didn't expect was that the elements of Harmony would actually work.
Or the thing that happened at the end... What exactly happened at the end? Why were the physical Elements of Harmony destroyed? Where did Twilight go? Did Oceanus just intervened? Or was it someone else? Or maybe it was Moon Shadow herself using some kind of slip from Pyre's concentration? And who exactly is Moon Shadow? "Master Oceanus, your handmaiden beseeches you!" - doesn't sound too good.
With this chapter, a single action packed chapter we lost Twilight and the elements of Harmony. And the worst part is, now I know the next chapter will take place in Heartland because this is big enough cliffhanger to torture us with for next week or two.
If I'm to guess where twilight is, I think she went to wherever Pyre/Nightmare Moon went.
so now we have a quest to find Twilight
a quest to find Black Rose... who might also want to find Twilight
a quest to figure out what happened to the elements... although I suspect the physical manifestations aren't really that important.
and there will probably be few side quests involving each of the main characters, such as AJ and the past of her family, Pinkie and the creepy earth pony magic thingy, Fluttershy savng Redbrand's soul, RD's race with Scarlet (and potential romance/tragedy afterwards)... and something for Rarity... oh, and Spike... and... oh forget it... it looks like Breaking Point was just a prologue.
welp. was that #8?
ReplyDeleteWell, I suppose it's a good thing that it's been shown that you don't need to be wearing an element to use it (see: AJ). Still, there goes a major morale/confidence boost. :/
How much do you want to bet the King's showing up in the finale now? >:D
@Visiden Visidane
Author's word is author's choice then. I still wonder how you could keep them from being essentially demoted to side characters, but as you've shown in your most recent chapter, you know best :D About the Stare, see the end of the episode. She uses it casually on Angel to get him to eat salad, despite it not being an emergency or stressful situation. She does this while narrating the moral about being assertive.
@Adalbertus Morridath
ReplyDelete> Or the thing that happened at the end... What exactly happened at the end? [...]
so many new questions...
> And the worst part is, now I know the next chapter will take place in Heartland because this is big enough cliffhanger to torture us with for next week or two.
or it could switch to Spike and Seethe Scale, but yes we won't be seeing this plot line for at least a chapter or two
> If I'm to guess where twilight is, I think she went to wherever Pyre/Nightmare Moon went.
eeyup, my guess exactly, (warning, complete speculation ahead) and if pyre got separated from NMM and now they're stuck in Oceanus's realm, and now they have to work together to get out, which would be interesting, considering pyre wants to kill twilight, and the feeling might be mutual...
> it looks like Breaking Point was just a prologue.
eeyup, you know a story has reached epic levels of complexity, when you need a 48 chapter prologue just to set up the main story
@The Wandering Magus
> welp. was that #8?
guess we'll find out soon, but I highly doubt it
> How much do you want to bet the King's showing up in the finale now?
we alway's knew that he would most likely show up, but maybe it'll turn out that Oceanus is actually good, because he's trying to preserve mortal ponies, so maybe the alicorns will join Oceanus because they don't want their little ponies to die, plus all the other races would probably join as well, because they'll be wiped out as well, but it will probably be for nothing because The King is all powerful
Ok, this is a blind guess, but what if...
ReplyDeleteTwilight went to see Oceanus and will discover his true intentions and see that, in her eyes at least, he's the good guy and then she returns to Equestria and tells the alicorns what she saw and then boom, the 8th rebellion (either between the alicorn siblings, or the siblings vs the King) and 9th rebellion is when it all turns out to be a huge deception made by Oceanus, or when Oceanus actually turns out to be the good guy... or something.
But probably not. <_<
And if Pyre survived and got separated from Nightmare Moon... hot Twilight X Pyre action? (read it as you wish :P) and I hope they weren't teleported to Oceanus... isn't that suppose to be on the bottom of the ocean or something?
@Adalbertus Morridath
ReplyDelete> Twilight went to see Oceanus [...]
interesting idea, I could see it happening...
don't you love wild mass guessing?
> hot Twilight X Pyre action
have I mentioned I hate you?
> isn't that suppose to be on the bottom of the ocean or something?
well of course there'll be some kind of air-bubble thing, so that she won't drown (that would be a cheap death)
@The Wandering Magus
ReplyDeleteI saw that as just a normal look of determination which is part of the lesson of that episode. People can be pretty reasonable and you can express disagreement without kicking their asses or resorting to supernatural petrification-reversing gazes.
Yay! Part 4 =P
ReplyDeleteCliffhanger. We meet again. AND THIS TIME YOU'RE HIDING TWILIGHT'S FATE FROM ME. ლ(ಠ益ಠლ)
ReplyDeleteAfter reading all chapters of Upheavel: The Breaking Point i have to say this:
ReplyDeleteIt was a fast-paced, intense, wild read with lots of twists and turns and alot of emotions packed in it.
That said, the pony i felt most for in this story was Twilight Sparkle. Honestly after those 48 chapters i have no idea how the hay this filly can still smile or even be up on her hooves. If i had been in her stead i had either become a heavy drunkard, had deserted or find some other way to free myself from such a fate which no matter what you does will let you fail.
And that though she hadnt done anything or much wrong. I guess we all can agree that it was right when she stood up to her teacher and asked her to take down the barrier. Same when she didn´t wavered in her decision when her friends decided to stand with her. Or when she joined the Legion to fight the wolven, Nightmare moon/Pyre Valor and later Black Rose.
Yet no matter what she did, believing in her standards, her friends or her own abilities. No matter how much she trained, helped or fought, in the end she had always lost when it matters the most.
She got banished by her teacher and had to be responsible for her friends banishment too. She got injured, whipped and was used to almost kill her teach in the process to take her power. She lost again Pyre Valor and later after lots of training, lost against Nightmare Moon when it came to the last shot of power struggle between them. Let´s not forget Terratos 1000 year old pain and hopelessness thrown in a fit of shouts at Twilight.
I have the feeling among the Mane 6 she´s the one who did the most but is also the one who´s the most lost. She´d done anything she could, but it was to no prevail. She killed the most wolven, but she´s losing herself about one pony she hasn´t killed yet. She learned and advanced the most, but it were the others who been more useful than her when it mattered. She´s the one who got with Pyre Valor/Nghtmare Moon a hateful arch nemesis who will do anything to see her dead. And with Black Rose an alicorn enemy who sees her as a useful tool and a tasty meal once she´s bloomed. With Terrato she has a leader who despies her as much as Pyre Valor and Nightmare Moon together hates her. Luna has used her to achieve her goal to take down the barrier. Celstia didn´t had enough faith in her students decisions and beliefs and banished her. Half of her friends have no idea what she/RD/AJ had to do at the frontline, and that´s probably for the better. But RD and AJ have either no interest or no idea how to help Twilight as they´re busy with their own problems or feel overwhelmed by everyone´s problems.
I have the feeling that Visiden Visidane will have one of the three following scenarios in petto for Twilight when this fic comes to end:
She will die in battle in someway.
She will get sacrificed/sacrifices herself one way or another.
She will become a monster in pony form, void of everything Twilight Sparkle had been or stood up for.
I don't think it will happen in Reckoning yet, but i dont see an happy ending for her if this course continues. And it will continue that way. To her downfall. Her end, whatever it will be.
@James Rye
ReplyDeleteum, wow...grimdark look on things much?
here's my thoughs (also expect a similar comment from Adalbertus (another commenter)) on your comment:
> Honestly after those 48 chapters i have no idea how the hay this filly can still smile or even be up on her hooves. If i had been in her stead i had either become a heavy drunkard, had deserted or find some other way to free myself from such a fate which no matter what you does will let you fail.
heh, you call this grimdark? Fallout: Equestria is at least twice as bad, and Project horizons is five times as bad (maybe even more), and yet both Lilpip and Blackjack keep on living/surviving even after all they've seen/done and they came from equally naive places (blackjack less so). Well to be fair, Blackjack does drink a lot (not sure if to escape or just likes to drink, probably both) and has almost committed suicide at least once now.
Plus belief in a cause, in Twilight's case 'defending Equestria', is all you need to stave off despair/hopelessness. Plus she has all her friends with her. I don't think this story's as grimdark as you make it out to be.
> She killed the most wolven, but she´s losing herself about one pony she hasn´t killed yet.
I assume you're talking about Pyre/NMM
well, I didn't see an obsession over Pyre/NMM during my read through (I really need to read it beginning to end again) It's more of a 'I know I'm not good enough to face her, therefore I need to get better', well I guess it could be considered an obsession...
> With Terrato she has a leader who despise her as much as Pyre Valor and Nightmare Moon together hates her.
I don't think Terrato really despises Twilight per say, it's more of a combination of his repressed hate of Celestia for abandoning him in barrier lands for 1000+ years while she ruled the land of peace and harmony which is/was the Heartland, and seeing that Celestia trusts/cares more for Twilight, who she'd only known for 10-15 years, instead of Terrato who stood by her side for 2000+ years (plus how ever many they were part of the eternal herd for), plus whatever's left of his feelings/hate for Black Rose, who was his Protégé and he's seeing aspects of her in Twilight
> Luna has used her to achieve her goal to take down the barrier.
wait…what? since when did Luna actively plan to take down the barrier? all she did was go to the barrier lands to help out/regain the trust of Terrato
the barrier got taken down by Black Rose, nothing which Luna did affected that.
> Celestia didn't have enough faith in her students decisions and beliefs and banished her.
well like the story said, Celestia had 1000+ years to reenforce her believe that the barrier was a good thing, and Twilight knew going in that she would have little chance of changing Celestia's view
> Half of her friends have no idea what she/RD/AJ had to do at the frontline
well they did flee through the fighting at fang breaker, so I think the rest of the main6 have some kind of idea what frontline fighting is like
Hope you stick around here, it would be interesting to have someone with such a grimdark view on the story
Plus, can't wait to see what your take on Reckoning is so far...
@James Rye
ReplyDelete> um, wow...grimdark look on things much?
I like this guy already :D
Also, no quoting because of the character limit :|
@James Rye
Just wait till you read the 4th chapter of Reckoning :D
I agree that Twilight got it hard, but she's strong, she has her friends with her. Also, the fact that she tries to stay true to her words that she will join, she will help and she will fight for equestrian (something Vanguard used several times to additional motivate her).
And I agree that she is a little obsessed with Pyre, mostly because of her ambition to prove her she is a powerful mage, not some weak scared chosen pony. that and she probably wants to prove Vanguard that she's every bit as capable as a mage as Pyre was, you know, her completely unconscious jealousy.
Terrato doesn't hate her, he hates the idea of her. He hates that a little weak mortal pony who betrayed Celestia still has more attention and is closer to his older sister than he is after a 1000 years of loyal service and sacrifices. I think he's admiring Twilight as a pony and her relationship with Celestia aside he'd put her through enough to make her a high-ranking commander as soon as possible.
As for Luna, she didn't actively used Twilight to bring down the barrier, she definitely did not plan for all the things that happened... but she did use her to indicate all that happened.
I think by now, with the siege of Bastion City, fight with nightmare Moon and now with (potential spoiler) – siege of FangBreaker –(end of spoiler) the special care squad saw enough front lines action to say that they are not innocent anymore. Still, RD, AJ and Twilight still are the most experienced of the six and it will have to be somehow fixed.
Oh, and the grim future of Twilight... I'm not quite sure how Upheaval will end, for all we know it might end with an apocalypse of the 9th rebellion. But at the moment we don't even know what happened in the end of the last chapter, so let's wait with ending guessing :p
More spoilers
I've been thinking about the elements of harmony. The alicorn siblings probably know that physical representations of the elements aren't all that important, but if Terrato thinks that the elements are lost, will he disband the special care squad? Without Twilight they are useless as a squad anyways and Fluttershy, Pinkie and Rarity have jobs elsewhere. Sure, Rarity could be useful in fights bur he needs a lot of training and Pinkie... well, we still don't know much about the earth pony sect...
So, will Terrato keep the squad together?