• Season 2, Episode 9: Sweet and Elite - Discussion

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    Rarity episode time! What kind of breakdown will she go through?

    Saturday, December 3, 2011 op
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    1,049 comments:

    1. AshtonDecember 4, 2011 at 4:15 AM

      >>RailRide said...
      >>Watching a full-body coat of mud slide off her with two
      >>shakes of her head, all I could think of was..."Rarity.
      >>Now with Teflon."

      lol. But it is oddly cannon that the ponies have skin, not fur (shown numerous times, but most obvious example was RD drawing a watch on her arm with a pencil in 'Party of One') so it's not all that strange when you think about that...

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    2. RushingRouletteDecember 4, 2011 at 4:57 AM

      @Ashton

      As tenuously canon as it may be, Equestria Gurls mentions furry coats... It kind of creeps me out thinking they don't have fur.

      ReplyDelete
    3. UnknownDecember 4, 2011 at 5:12 AM

      AWESOME ALL THE WAY !!!!

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    4. El_DaraxDecember 4, 2011 at 5:16 AM

      PART CANNON YAY!

      Seriously...party connon was the awesomeest part of this ep.

      The Rarity Celestia interaction at the beggining was fun to see. Don't get to see the other mane 5 with her one on one...in fact this may of been a first.

      I was pleasently surprised by this ep........and that's with Rarity being my 2nd least fav of the mane cast.

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    5. RodneylivesDecember 4, 2011 at 6:57 AM

      @Koharu

      Fleur sounds like a good name for the pink pony. Maybe Fleur de Lys?

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    6. FryFuturamaFrozerBronieDecember 4, 2011 at 7:10 AM

      Im Fry and im awesome..............


      PINKIE PIE HER PARTY CANNON!!!!!

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    7. FryFuturamaFrozerBronieDecember 4, 2011 at 7:17 AM

      Fry Loves Pinkie
      PINKIE YU ROCK WITH YOUR CANNON!!!!

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    8. SwedbanderDecember 4, 2011 at 8:12 AM

      Fancy Pants is Swedish?!

      His cutie mark is three open three-pointed crowns, Or, placed two above one, which is a national emblem of Sweden.

      Is Fancy Pants perhaps modeled after prince Carl, duke of Västergötland? That would be fitting, since he was a cavalry officer.

      Or maybe F P:s talent is Swedish military equipment? :-)

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    9. SwedbanderDecember 4, 2011 at 8:24 AM

      Now we need pictures of Fancy Pants wearing Swedish cavalry uniform model 1895! Stat! :-D
      (See Zorn's painting "Blå prinsen" for reference)

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    10. StoneMasonDecember 4, 2011 at 8:32 AM

      This episode was bloody awesome.

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    11. invizalolDecember 4, 2011 at 8:33 AM

      I don't usually comment, but after Sethisto's notice, I felt compelled to add my appreciation for yet another awesome show! At the end of every episode I'm left wondering how they'll manage to match it with the next, and each time I'm pleasantly surprised with an overload of awesomeness!

      I grin every time I picture Twilight's goofy dancing with a tablecloth over her back! Hilarious stuff! Fantastic episode!

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    12. AnonymousDecember 4, 2011 at 8:58 AM

      @Sheffield Makoto Good call on naming the song. ^_^ Congrats!

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    13. AnonymousDecember 4, 2011 at 9:11 AM

      @Evine To answer your question 'why there is so much focus on Opal' (Rarity's cat), it is because she is there not just for comic relief, she's Rarity's conscience.

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    14. AnonymousDecember 4, 2011 at 9:35 AM

      @Bugsydor Party cannon attack idea for Fighting is Magic: If Pinkie manages to hit you (aim is crucial or this would be too easy) you dance for x seconds while your vital signs drop. Make Pinkie dance while her opponent dances and Pinkie gains vitality while the vitality of her opponent drops (transfer of vitality).

      I wouldn't play Fighting is Magic or watch Twilight getting clobbered (eek!) but that doesn't stop me from thinking up ideas. 8^D And yes, Fighting is Magic is an awesome project, kudus too all involved.

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    15. AnonymousDecember 4, 2011 at 10:15 AM

      @Ashton In one of the Artist Training Ground exercises (oh how I wish it would return) I played with the idea of fur vs skin on ponies. The challenge was draw a pony with a blade, so I drew Pinkie Pie with a straight razor. The gag was that Pinkie is in fact a yellow pony with a pink mane and tail, and I had her shaving off the yellow fur to reveal her pink skin. below. 8^D

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    16. AnonymousDecember 4, 2011 at 10:18 AM

      @XyroTR1 Thank you once again for the uploads! Your efforts are a godsend for so many with no access to the Hub.

      ReplyDelete
    17. RafasdeDecember 4, 2011 at 10:53 AM

      SO WE MET AGAIN, PRINCE BLUEBLOOD.

      Srsly, this episode was completely awesome.

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    18. jodyjm13December 4, 2011 at 11:58 AM

      @RailRide
      I don't think Fancypants is perfect (when he first met Rarity, he didn't seem terribly interested in her until she mentioned knowing Celestia), but I do believe his fondness for Rarity's friends and his appreciation of Twilight's dress were sincere.

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    19. jodyjm13December 4, 2011 at 12:02 PM

      @mycutiemarkisagun
      Dangit, why do you make us wait so long to read your comments on the new episodes? And I thought it was settled that human Twilight would have to be either Semetic or Asian.

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    20. PistolePlexDecember 4, 2011 at 12:09 PM

      Thanks for linking my video on here Seth! :D

      I was pretty surprised to see characters from previous episodes making an appearance such as Hoity Toity, Photo Finish and Prince Blueblood.
      I was like, DAT CONTINUITY.

      Personally, I love all the ponies (Mane 6) and I was glad they made an appearance. The plot itself wasn't that predcitable unlike "May the Best Pet Win", which I love.

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    21. Bangor MC 3rdDecember 4, 2011 at 1:37 PM

      I got entirely too excited seeing Octavia again. I think my bronyism is out of control... Curse you, well-written fanfiction!

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    22. DiscordDecember 4, 2011 at 1:49 PM

      Anyone else sense some Awesome new dubstep remixes in the near future?

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    23. ManulousDecember 4, 2011 at 2:09 PM

      PonyArchive is down for a "surprise :)". Any idea what that might be?

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    24. BiboDecember 4, 2011 at 2:14 PM

      @mycutiemarkisagun

      wat?

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    25. milleniummaster18December 4, 2011 at 2:26 PM

      Very good episode, I believe. With the exception that she got off the hook quite easily. Guess the bible was wrong on this one, what goes around doesn't come around as much.

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    26. Cinnamon FritterDecember 4, 2011 at 2:40 PM

      @Harwick

      I absolutely loved this episode. It's definitely one of my top three favs for the whole series. I would go into more detail, but out of 1,000+ comments, I'm sure everything I would say has already been stated at re-iterated a dozen times over already.

      And I believe Harwick has certainly has said it best when it comes to all the neigh-sayers and anti-Rarity trolls out there. Beautifully worded, Harwick

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    27. UnknownDecember 4, 2011 at 6:35 PM

      I'm 99% sure that big band song at the party is "Good to Go" by Denver and the Mile High Orchestra. But I can't confirm it anywhere online. :\

      ReplyDelete
    28. milleniummaster18December 4, 2011 at 6:37 PM

      Let me expand on what I already just said. I've been thinking for quite a long time and I think I figured out what's the thing that's wrong with this episode and bothers the crap out of me: it's too anti-moralistic.

      Though it's undoubtedly a very good episode artistically and musically. Its moral value is overall a piece of shit throughout the entire episode: Rarity being herself and trying to fit with a bunch of people who, lets face it, are a bunch of self-important pricks (with the one exception); Rarity singing about how she should be the pony that should be known by everyone (blatant egoism, rather than ambition); her attempts at covering up her "country" roots and deceiving her friends, until she finally gives in. Then, what happens? It gets covered up, nobody seems to get mad at Rarity and she gets away with a measly "I learned a lesson" stamp.
      It doesn't add up, things work out for her too much for this episode's good (the dress, etc). The story builds for almost the entirety of the episode on deception and lies only to have a quick resolution that doesn't really tie up loose ends.
      This episode's overall reception is proof that the audience was effectively conned by the spectacular story-telling of what was, in reality, the poorest story as of now.

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    29. AshtonDecember 4, 2011 at 8:07 PM

      >>Shutter said...
      >>As tenuously canon as it may be, Equestria Gurls
      >>mentions furry coats...

      I question this because we see many instances of the ponies wearing makeup, which would be extremely time-consuming and difficult at best with fur, not to mention in this most recent ep even, rarity was powdering her face, which would not be needed with fur, as I mention dash drawing a watch on her arm, and also in Lesson Zero we see Dash using sunscreen, which would both be needless and rather hard to work down to the skin if there's fur involved. When the ponies get wet there is no 'jagged fur' effect on the edges (like we clearly see on Opal in last ep when she gets wet) Things like the mud have been used many times too, overall I havnt seen a single instance that points to them having fur except the 1 comment from 101 where Twilight is worried rarity is going to "Dye my coat another color!"

      And, of course, with fur the cutie marks would be a lot less visible, easier to change/hide, and woudl be less distinct...

      Overall, while I agree it seems very strange wo think of ponies with skin (especially technicolor skin) it seems to be the only possibility

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    30. Cinnamon FritterDecember 4, 2011 at 10:50 PM

      @Ashton

      Ponies have very short fur, which is much easier to dye/paint on; which people have been doing to animals for centuries. Native Americans would draw designs on their horses, and in more modern cases with other animal such as Petey from the Little Rascals and the Target dog during the late 90's Target ad campaign.

      And animals do actually get sunburned, even with the presence of fur. Down here in Texas, despite the temperature being in the upper 90's 11.5 months out of the year, vets strongly discourage giving short cuts to certain dogs such as chow chows and huskies. Even if you left a full inch of fur, longer than that of a horses fur, enough sunlight would get through to burn their sensitive skin and make life generally suck just as much as it would with a triple layer coat in 98 degree weather.

      And I think the cutie mark is a part of their fur pattern, not so much a magical tattoo on the skin. Many animals have a uniform skin color while their fur patterns vary greatly. I know the skin on my scalp under my brown hair is the same light tan that the rest of my skin is. Now that I think about it, I've been sunburned on my head before as well, even though I have shoulder length hair.

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    31. AnonymousDecember 4, 2011 at 10:53 PM

      I quite like this episode & the song.
      Though @milleniummaster18 has a point, I didn't really bother to analyse the episode to that depth, and so i didn't notice that till i saw the comment.

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    32. pmcollectorboyDecember 4, 2011 at 11:06 PM

      Anybody notice they were playing Ravel's Bolero during the part when she was giving Opal a soaking?

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    33. HMorris73December 5, 2011 at 1:24 AM

      @milleniummaster18
      "This episode's overall reception is proof that the audience was effectively conned by the spectacular story-telling of what was, in reality, the poorest story as of now."

      Wow that's an arrogant statement. It never occurred to you that anyone could either have a legitimately different view on the morals of the episode or simply not place as much importance on them as you?

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    34. AnonymousDecember 5, 2011 at 1:55 AM

      @millenimummaster18

      For my taste, the episode is too moralistic, in that it spends so much time on Rarity's decisionmaking and its consequences. But it is an impressive character study, so I can understand why so many bronies really liked it.

      The restaurant scene establishes what's going on. Rarity loves the whole idea of Canterlot, and wants badly to fit in there. The initial design of the dress, and the acceptance of the first invitation, are all based on that desire despite what she tells herself. Just look at her stamp in place once she gives herself permission to go. By the time we get to the song, her desire is crystal clear.

      Still, Rarity doesn't want to disappoint Twilight. She deceives herself in what's possible with the dress. She actively lies to keep from hurting the relationship. Yes, these are bad things to do. But that's obvious, and Rarity's stress should be sufficient editorial comment.

      The script has bigger fish to fry. The moral point of the final minutes is about friends accepting each other, despite their imperfections. Twilight accepts that Rarity visits the other party; she likes and trusts her anyway. Because of that, she naturally puts the best construction on it. Rarity accepts that her Ponyville friends aren't sophisticated in Canterlot terms; she ultimately is proud of them anyway. This is much more valuable and cheering than a simple "Do not lie" lesson.

      IMO, without that note of grace at the end, this wouldn't qualify as a good pony episode. Ponies make most things better, but you could have the fitting-in-at-a-cost story without them. But the overall good cheer of the show, and trust that morals can be expressed without sledgehammers, are hard to find elsewhere.

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    35. UnknownDecember 5, 2011 at 3:14 AM

      Anybody else whose day was totally made when Photo Finish and company showed up at the Gallery Exhibition?

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    36. richfilesDecember 5, 2011 at 4:02 AM

      @mycutiemarkisagun

      Man... you are a RIOT!!! YES!!!
      I am laughing so hard!!! :D

      The "gems"...

      ---"AIRSHIPS CANON, WE'RE GETTING MORE AND MORE CANON STEAMPUNK UP IN HURR"
      You can't go wrong with steampunk OR airships! Steampunk has been so canon, especially Twi's STEAM puffing EEG machine in her basement lab, but this is the culmination of epic awesome!

      ---"URINATION IS CANON"
      I think I "canoned" a little when i read that, I laughed so hard. There's also Spikes S1 mention of an outhouse.

      ---Twilight's dancing in this ep settles any and all "is Humanized Twilight black?" arguments now and forever.
      You win what's left of what I got... Hmm... I already gave all my internets to Studio DHX for producing this awesome show, so I don't have any of those left. I'm in the process of moving all my crap out of my house cause the bank is being so kind as to free me of this terribly expensive mortgage. I think I have few bottles of Faygo in the fridge... I'd share that? Seriously... I loved Twilight's adorkable inability to coordinate her 4 limbs in synchronization with each other... I'd love to hug her, but I don't want the bruises or concussion that would result from approaching that oh so adorkable... thing... she calls dancing! :D

      As usual... Once again, you win at being MOTHER BUCKING AWESOME

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    37. richfilesDecember 5, 2011 at 4:43 AM

      @Pyrite

      You refer to the party as Fancy Pants party...

      However, if you will recall, the invite was from Jet Set and Upper Crust, not from Fancy Pants. Fancy Pants was simply important enough to both be also invited, and fully influence the other guests and hosts of the party with his opinions, thus saving Rarity's little white plot.

      @Ashton

      As Shutter said, "Equestria Girls" has the specific lyric "Furry coats". Not to mention all the uses of the term coat in the actual show. It's NEVER been canon.

      A horse's coat tends to lay quite flat and is very glossy. Whether makeup on fur is difficult or not does not meant it's not impossible. There are instances of animals getting sunburn THROUGH fur, so sunscreen applied over the coat and maybe rubbed into it IS a potential viable thing. As I said before, a horse's coat (and by extension, pony) can lay very smooth when well groomed. As for cutiemarks. It's magic, that don't have to explain horse manure! Still, if the coat is thin in the flank area, a fur based cutiemark is indeed a possibility. I've even seen some fanart that depicts this quite well. Also... Fur and feathers can develop with a manner of alternating pigment patterns and genetic switches are turned on and off by various chemical switches. My cat has subtle grey, black, and white stripes... the pattern is actually in EVERY SINGLE fur strand.

      Also, back to the makeup bit... as Cinnamon Fritter said, Horses coats have been used as artistic canvases. it's not that absurd to apply those concepts to makeup, which is EVEN LESS precisely defined than body paint.

      As far as I'm concerned, ponies without furry coats is pure absurdity! The evidence is STRONGLY against your opinion, in Every. Possible. Way. Seriously!

      @pmcollectorboy
      LOL! I missed Bolero during Opal's soaking! I love that tune. I also love the mix by Gigi D'Agostino on L'amour Toujour II. (one of only half a dozen albums EVER that I love EVERY single song, first to last track, without any doubt). I'm quite frankly surprised that I missed it!

      Thanks for pointing it out... Now does anyone know what the epic tune at the VERY beginning was? I feel like I've heard it, but I can't for the life of me place it...

      Also, my final thoughts...

      Awesome song was awesome.

      And Twilight can't dance... Which is Just the way I like her! Squee! :D

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    38. FlorentineDecember 5, 2011 at 9:21 AM

      This comment has been removed by the author.

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    39. FlorentineDecember 5, 2011 at 9:34 AM

      Stupid inability to edit... >.>
      ----
      Well.. perhaps a bit late to the party, but all the same I wanted to say it /somewhere/:

      I think this is my favourite episode of season 2 yet!

      Up until now, I'd had this curious sense that something's been somehow lacking - nothing I could put a finger on, but somehow.. a flicker less nuance in the animation or something? Nothing substantial or worth complaining about, but whatever happens, this episode dispelled that feeling.

      A great song, more exploration of a part of Equestrian society I'm interested in, a story I certainly really enjoyed, character guest appearances... That airship o.o

      Thanks to the creators, again, or so XD

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    40. RixDecember 5, 2011 at 10:38 AM

      @AlexReffand

      I recall there was a lot of dispute over the moral in "Suited For Success".

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    41. pmcollectorboyDecember 5, 2011 at 12:29 PM

      My review. I've only got one criteria for an episode. Does it make me smile? The bigger the smile, the better the grade. I'm looking for that intangible feeling of being 10 again and watching Saturday morning cartoons. Sisterhooves Social had this quality. Sweet and Elite had it and more. Many episodes make me go "That was great." This one made me go "That was brilliant." I could barely contain myself from start to finish. By the end, it moved me almost to tears.

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    42. chiusaDecember 5, 2011 at 1:42 PM

      I loved the episode! I always look forward to Rarity-centric episodes so that is one reason why I enjoyed it. I enjoyed the whole feel of Canterlot, despite the majority of the nobility (from what we've seen anyway) being stuck-up and haughty. I understand that some of you may think of Rarity as arrogant for wanting to be "the pony everypony should know" but she just wants to be noticed! All ponies in an important industry are set on that particular goal!

      I also loved Fleur De Lis.
      She is so pretty.
      I don't care if she's a trophy wife or arm candy.
      I want FancyxFleur shipping.
      I will give all my LOVE, MONEY AND PONY TO THIS SHIPPING.

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    43. StonerSunshineDecember 5, 2011 at 7:49 PM

      After watching this episode all I can say is:

      Rarity just reinforced significantly my notion that she is a Spy

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    44. Spitfire not the wonderboltDecember 5, 2011 at 10:54 PM

      I'll be the toast of the town, the guy on the go
      I'm the type of pony everypony, everypony should know
      I'll be the one to watch, the colt in the flow
      I'm the type of pony everypony, everypony should know
      Becoming as popular as popular can be
      Making my mark, making my mark in high society
      I'm the duke of the dance, the star of the show, yeah
      I'm the type of pony everypony, everypony should know
      See how they hang on every word that I speak
      My approving glance is what they all seek
      I'm the crème de la crème, not just another John Doe
      I'm the type of pony everypony should know
      At home, at the opera, on a fancy yacht
      Becoming the talk, the talk of all of Canterlot
      I'm the crème de la crème, not just another John Doe, yeah
      I'm the type of pony everypony, everypony should know
      Because I'm the type of pony
      Yes, I'm the type of pony
      Yes, I'm the type of pony everypony should know


      So... possible male lyrics to the new song? For those still enjoying the concept of gender-swapped ponies.

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    45. AshtonDecember 6, 2011 at 12:46 AM

      It amazes me so many posts here get <50 comments and die... this post is on it's way to 1100!

      @ Cinnamon Fritter:
      Very good points, when I looked some of those up I have to agree. And I suppose cosmetology would have developed more fur-based in a pony society, so perhaps it really is as easy for them as it is for humans...

      Honestly the only thing still not fitting is the pencil-watch, which at this point I'm willing to chalk up to "cartoon antics" like 3/4 of what Pinky does...

      @ richfiles:
      Please calm down, I am not trying to step on anyone's toes. I've been very calm and tried to avoid any angry words here. I'm trying to keep this a discussion and not a fight. If you took it as an aggressive insult, I sincerely apologize...

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    46. Falcon1991December 6, 2011 at 12:39 PM

      Totally loved the episode. Great humour too. :)

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    47. AnonymousDecember 9, 2011 at 1:53 AM

      You go, Rarity!
      Love this episode, it really shows the best of Rarity I think.

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    48. AnonymousDecember 9, 2011 at 10:56 PM

      Midnight run got shutdown

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    49. ArothyssDecember 10, 2011 at 12:07 PM

      Fancy Pants' reaction to those two jerks at the end:

      "Mmm... yes. Now then..."

      R. O. F. L.

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